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Tithe is Old Testimit law for the jews...But since we live under grace now were not justified by the Law.....Paul write this in 2nd Cor...each man is to gives what is in his heart and not under complusion. also he who sows sparingly reeps sparingly for God loves a cheerful giver.....I would never tell anyone to give an exact amount its between you and God. Then giving of ones time can be more valuable than money. Pastors in America use the thite sermon to put a guilt trip on people.. My pastor never teaches on tithing but giving .. We never have a offering during service but the peope at the church give above what is needed..... What i can tell from this news report is the name it claim it church are doing a number on its congeraton by lying to them that if they dont give ten percent that God is disapointed with them.... philly |
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I agree, at the small ministry that I am Pastor
we give so much we are actually able to do
ministry. feed the hungry, clothe the needy
visit the sick,and minister to those in jail.
Jesus did not die on a cross for you to wear
a mink coat,drive a rolls royce, or live in a Manson
He died so you can be free from sin for service.
Pastor if you want to live the lifestyles of the rich
and famous do like Jesus,Peter and Paul.
GET A JOB!!! |
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Pastor/ The Christ
I agrre with the both of you. This is a wake up call for a lot of people. This is something that has been on my heart. So many people are using the churches to get rich. I really feel sorry for them because they will have to face God and I say WOE to them. The ones that are doing the right thing will get their crowns.
Be Blessed |
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Trukki |
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April 05, 2008 at 2:30pm |
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| Very interesting blog, thanks for the info. and God Bless you. :) |
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Susy Q |
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April 05, 2008 at 3:25pm |
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| Why is it that we have no problem with rap stars and athletes living high off of our money, but the man that God has sent to give the word of life should live poorly. Jesus came so that we have an abundant life. So why do we feel like mansions and nice things are only for those who are not in Christ. To say we don't have to abide by Old Testament law would be to say the ten commandments are useless. They are in the old testament after all. God's law is God's law. The fact that you are forgiven from sin by the blood Jesus shed for us all does not excuse you from doing what's right. Tithing was around before the law. The law just established its importance and help explain to the people what the tithe is for. In our church tithing is part of worship. It is an act of love that expresses our desire to support the spread of the Gospel and to show our gratititude to God for his blessings. It is not a guilt trip. If the only reason you are giving is to avoid the guilt trip, you should keep your tainted offering. The truth is everything we have belongs to God (Matthew 19:21). Your tithe is not just your money. So many times we think of only the monetary aspects. You are to give of yourself as well. The fact that there is no direct instruction in the new testament does not relieve us of our duty. I am not fooled. I know there are some out there working in the name of getting rich, but don't look down on people because they choose to not have the head of their church have to worry about anything except saving souls and adding to the Kingdom. |
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The head of the Church is Jesus.
Jesus said foxes have holes, birds have nest,
but the son of man have nowhere to lay his head.
There are 4 different tithes in the Old Testament
why stop at Malachi.
Can you save soul on the golf course, On a Bahama
cruise.I know all preachers are not doing this but far
to many are and it has given true ministry a bad rap.
I work a full time job I still visit the sick go out
and knock on doors and preach on the corners.
According to Old Testament law the ones that did the
maintenance in the temple was the levitical priest this
is why they did not have an inheritance this why they
received tithes so today why do we have committees
to do the work that the pastor should do based on the
levitical priest job the Pastor not the janitor should clean
the church. come on now he is doing full-time ministry
the priest could not hold a job because the work in the
temple was a enormous task it required them to do full
time ministry. I am not being funny I clean our fellowship
I clean the bathrooms and I don't even get a salary. If I did
why should the people that pay my salary have to do jobs or
pay someone to do a job that since I don't work I could do
that would save the church some money. do you feel me.
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Susy Q |
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April 06, 2008 at 7:29am |
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I think you know what I meant by "head of the church". We all know that Jesus is the head of the church. Sounds like we are convicting most for the actions of a few. Working in the ministry is everyone's responsibility. But, the pastor has an awesome responsibility and goes through things that most of us could not handle. I believe the Lord blesses me so I can continue to bless others. I will never stop giving as the Spirit leads me. It takes money to provide ministry to the lost. And I will never stop giving of my time. If I am wrong for paying tithes, what have I really lost? A little bit of my McDonald's money. I have never felt pressured or guilted into giving. I give from my heart. It goes back to what I said before, everything I have and all that I am belongs to God. It is not mine anyway.
God Bless |
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It is said that there is nothing new under the sun. The word is the word and it is taught in my church to give 10% tithes and offerings. My pastor works every day. Any the only offering is paid is tithes and offering. I beleive that even if you sowed into your pastor's life that is ok also. I think tht people have abused people so bad in the ministry that people judge everyone by somebody else's mistakes. |
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I am not saying it is a bad thing, I am saying that
it is taught in the church as a law and the curse
applies if you do not and that is incorrect.
I give, I give more than 10% I just don't teach that
you must give 10% and if you don't you are cursed
with a curse. I can see that it is a touchy subject
but no one teaches about tithe. it is just Malachi
3;8-10. Has anyone ever read the whole book of
Malachi? Who was God angry with? Who has
robbed God even This whole Nation? There are
people who have paid tithes all their lives according
to the text a window is to open up and pour you out
a blessing you won't have room enough to receive.
Has that happen to anyone? Is the devourer in the
text sickness or locust. In churches today or I will say
in some places it is taught sickness which means if
you pay your tithes you will not be sick and you will
have abundance or in some teachings your wallet will
never be empty. I am not making this up. there are to
many people who have died broke,hungry and sick and
have paid tithes almost all of their lives. Now that is Gods
word and He can't lie or it is taught incorrectly and that is
not what the text means. Maybe I'm wrong if I am and some
one can shed truth on the matter please do so. I have
studied tithing and I have found that the people who teach
really don't under stand it. I search for truth. what about you?
www.shouldthechurchteachtithes.com |
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here is my thought on this: I am against the established Whore, but believe He has a remnant that believe in Him and not doctrines of man, but I still think that the Lord is the same as He was then. If He setup a way to take care of those that can't care for themselves, and in turn a blessing for those that give, why would He change? The Whore wants to take the tithes and setup their own kingdoms, and build multi-million dollar idols called a church building, When He set us up as the Church. The remnant use the tithe to care for the poor, feed the hungry, help the widow with the money put aside by tithing. It is the same old problem man has had with money (wealth), it corrupts. But if the fellowship shepherd uses the money as designed by the Lord, and remembers that it is not his money to use, but it is for the ministry. Should the shepherd work, Paul did. I truly believe that the body is better off going from home to home, but man wants some thing tangible to look at and say, see here is what, oops I mean where I worship. here is what the Lord game me on the shepherds http://www.mychurch.org/blog/147849/For-the-shepherds pray about reading this. |
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I agree with Paul, there's always an opportunity for abuse. If I had thousands of souls in the balance, I would rather have my own jet then to expect an airline to always have me on time and certainly, I would never judge a brother who wins 1000's of souls yearly even if they do fall short in some areas. Souls are priceless. Blessed are those that feed the introduction to eternal life, whether they get a salary from a church or sell books and videos. 'Money changers' and thieves have been everywhere, and money is ransom for a man's life. And the love of money...
We should go beyond the 1/10th and share all things in common (Acts) to really graduate above all. Bottom line, its' between you and God. If He can use you as a vessel to give unto others, he will provide the means, as you say to help the needy. |
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Gene |
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April 08, 2008 at 11:04pm |
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I'm seriously concerned about even calling it a tithe (tenth) when the average giving is only about 4% anyway. Waddaya call that - a quadentile?
The concept should be about giving to further the needs and share the opportunity to grow the kingdom. |
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Tina |
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April 11, 2008 at 1:06pm |
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Great post! And also a very touchy subject among many who are a part of the body of Christ. It is unfortunate that it has forced many people from preaching on tithing. The good ole' "phooey if do and phooey if I don't" motto. It is a no-win topic among our churches. I think a lot of pastor's are afraid they will turn people away from the churches and any hope of salvation if they talk about money in what is a greedy and "money-hungry" world. But it is an important topic none-the- less because the church body, churches, ministry requires money to function. We battle the lost and dying world on a daily basis. Unfortunately in a lost world the society tends to be greed-driven which renders us unable to do or obtain anything, what seems today, without a costly price tag attached. Bottom line is the church needs money to run its operational and mission needs in its entirety.
So what must one do if not sure about tithing? If one is having a struggle with what is right then call on the Lord and His word, not man, to guide/convict your heart on the matter. There are biblical principles/guidelines that need to be applied to the issue of tithing that I do stand bold in my belief for. For instance I am in complete agreement with what Susy Q said about giving because of a guilt trip. If anyone gives for that purpose alone they need to be well aware that they are giving it under wrongful circumstances. We are to give from the heart - with gladness. If not, yes Q...it is a tainted offering from my perspective as well. Also, everything does belong to our Lord. Everything! I believe tithing should be considered as a whole - everything which He has allowed in our lives/circumstances/abilities should account as a means of giving back to our Lord.
As for my own personal life - I have chosen not to work (employed job that is) right now because I am a mother with a desire to pursue a college degree and therefore have decided to devote the rest of my time (aside from my educational endeavors) and dedication to meet the needs of my family and the Lord and His missions. Currently I do a lot of works through the church; teaching, serving on committees, actively and willingly participating in our churches missions, etc. In this day and age, our family could definitely benefit if I were to seek employment and get a paying job. But I endue a monetary sacrifice daily for, what are to me and produce for me, more important life rewards and contributions. The importance comes from doing so with an honest and charitable heart. I do not necessarily sit down and write a tithe check out to my church every week to put into the offering plate, no. I do not calculate my "ten percent" and set some aside to specifically use when the church is holding a collection/donation for missions, no. However I do faithfully contribute to our church applicably. I do give my children cash to put in the offering plate and the Saint Jude's mission jar as well as giving the money or donation to them to contribute to the many other miscellaneous mission endeavors that are continually arising which require the church's bodily contributions to cover the costs. Also, In giving this way, we are incorporating into the hearts of our youth the importance of giving - as I believe God would have us to do - and creating "mission-minded" children of God. Without a paying job and during the month when certain "costly" bills are due (lol) we often find it hard to give back to the Lord monetarily. I am a firm believer that as long as a Christian is diligently giving back to God to the maximum ability and full potential that they are capable of doing and also with the honest and right motives, then the amount given at any one particular moment or instance is countless. I just believe that it is through ALL works as a whole (donating outgrown clothes, toys, or food to those in need; baking cookies to donate to a benefit/fundraiser; giving a fellow church member a ride to and from church because they do not have any others means of getting there, as well as other various countless daily acts...) and not always just by bread alone, that we can and should respectably return to God what rightfully belongs to Him in the first place. Do we have members of the congregations that never give that ten percent back? Indeed we do. But let them be accountable to God for their actions. Yes, I have times when I am unable to monetarily contribute that ten percent each week. But as a faithful and dedicated Christian I can account that my offerings to the Lord each week, when combined, does without a doubt in my heart exceed well above the allotted ten percent that God Biblically commands us to give. |
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Tina you are awsome,
You said so many great things I will however highlight a part
Tina wrote:
I am a firm believer that as long as a Christian is diligently giving back to God to the maximum ability and full potential that they are capable of doing and also with the honest and right motives, then the amount given at any one particular moment or instance is countless. I just believe that it is through ALL works as a whole (donating outgrown clothes, toys, or food to those in need; baking cookies to donate to a benefit/fundraiser; giving a fellow church member a ride to and from church because they do not have any others means of getting there, as well as other various countless daily acts...)
See this is what I have really been saying Now Tins according to some teachings how can you
be blessed if you are not giving 10% and they don't mean time or clothes or rides they mean
MONEY. Let's look at this scripture 4:34 Neither was there any among them that lacked: for as many as were possessors of lands or houses sold them, and brought the prices of the things that were sold, 4:35 And laid [them] down at the apostles' feet: and distribution was made unto every man according as he had need. 4:36And Joses, who by the apostles was surnamed Barnabas, (which is, being interpreted, The son of consolation,) a Levite, [and] of the country of Cyprus, 4:37 Having land, sold [it], and brought the money, and laid [it] at the apostles' feet.
Now if this had said tithes and offerings I would not argue the point but it says they sold
property and gave it to the Apostle and Distribution was made unto every man according as
he had need.
The problem is we have to pay someone to preach, to sing, to play,etc. Got to have heat in the
winter and air conditioning in the summer and by the time we do all of that we can't really
minister to the needs of people in need.yes i agree the way it is set up now the church does
need your money but not for ministry, it is so we don't lose the building and make sure our
leader looks as good as the Pastor down the street or better in his new car,suit, and home
in the suburbs.
If we would only study our bibles we would see that their is a way to do ministry without taxing
the people to death. I heard a Pastor tell his congregation our power bill averages 12 -14,000
a month that is 168,000 a year to keep the power on. do you know how many people we could
help with that kind of cash flow. that did not include His salary his staff and the music dept
and the janitorial staff. Church has become big business and we are good at that but what about
the real business of which it is everybody's job from the pulpit to the back door SOUL WINNING.
Like I said my wife and I give and give and give but tithing is not a Christian doctrine. It is a old testament commandment but if we bring tithes in the new testament church we may as well build a barn on the side of the church and plant a field while you are at it. because old testament teaching on tithes was always food not money and they had money back then STUDY. |
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Tina |
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April 12, 2008 at 7:39pm |
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Thank you for pointing that out to me along with the scripture as well. I will definitly continue to study. We would be lost and wondering without the good Lord's Word to follow!
Thanks again for the post. It is a great topic. Like we mentioned before so many fear bringing tithes, as well as many other biblical points, into discussion, teaching or preaching afraid to upset someone. Fact of any matter is-God gave us His word to utilize the entire contents!
Love you all! Your sister in Christ, Tina :) |
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You will never read anywhere in the Bible where money was given as a Tithe to the Lord. Now it might have been a part of some tithe, but only in rare cases such as a tithe of spoils in a aftermath battle. But NEVER was money given as a Tithe. A Tithe was a first fruit and a shadow of Jesus Christ. Now that the true and actual first fruit has come there was no need to continue the shadow first fruits as a tithe. Too tithe now is a continuance in the Old Law and a demand to keep the shadow active in place of the established present.
Keep in mind my friends. If you follow the Old Law, you must then keep all of it, or be guilty of breaking all of it.(1cor.15:23) (James 2:10)
I am not saying love offerings are of the Old Law. Love offerings from a cheerful heart is the New Testament way NOW. I am saying Tithing was a shadow or first fruit offering to God and has been fulfilled by the establishment of Jesus Christ. Money was NEVER a first fruit in the bible and never was it used as a shadow pointing to Jesus Christ.
Money is an image of another guy in the bible. I will let you figure that one out for yourselves. :)
Peace. |
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