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| Tithing |
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My friends, I need your help with an issue I have been wrestling with for quite a a while. the issue is tithing. Do I tithe? Yes. Do I belive that tithing is 100% required of the Christian? Not really. Most of us know what Malachi 3 says. For a refresher, lets look at the verses together.
3:6 For I, Jehovah, change not; therefore ye, O sons of Jacob, are not consumed. 3:7 From the days of your fathers ye have turned aside from mine ordinances, and have not kept them. Return unto me, and I will return unto you, saith Jehovah of hosts. But ye say, Wherein shall we return? 3:8 Will a man rob God? yet ye rob me. But ye say, Wherein have we robbed thee? In tithes and offerings. 3:9 Ye are cursed with the curse; for ye rob me, even this whole nation. 3:10 Bring ye the whole tithe into the store-house, that there may be food in my house, and prove me now herewith, saith Jehovah of hosts, if I will not open you the windows of heaven, and pour you out a blessing, that there shall not be room enough `to receive it'. 3:11 And I will rebuke the devourer for your sakes, and he shall not destroy the fruits of your ground; neither shall your vine cast its fruit before the time in the field, saith Jehovah of hosts.
Well.. this scripture has long been the authority to justify tithing. Then of course you have Levictus 23:9-14; which speaks of giving "firstfruits" to God and you have Deuteronomy 14:22-29; which also speaks of tithing. But what of the new testament? No mention at all. We know that Jesus came to fulfill the law, not abolish it. Is that a "new testament " justification for tithing. I just don't know. I do love waht Paul says in 2 Corinthians 9: 6-14. 9:6 But this `I say,' He that soweth sparingly shall reap also sparingly; and he that soweth bountifully shall reap also bountifully. 9:7 `Let' each man `do' according as he hath purposed in his heart: not grudgingly, or of necessity: for God loveth a cheerful giver. 9:8 And God is able to make all grace abound unto you; that ye, having always all sufficiency in everything, may abound unto every good work: 9:9 as it is written, He hath scattered abroad, he hath given to the poor; His righteousness abideth for ever. 9:10 And he that supplieth seed to the sower and bread for food, shall supply and multiply your seed for sowing, and increase the fruits of your righteousness: 9:11 ye being enriched in everything unto all liberality, which worketh through us thanksgiving to God. 9:12 For the ministration of this service not only filleth up the measure of the wants of the saints, but aboundeth also through many thanksgivings unto God; 9:13 seeing that through the proving `of you' by this ministration they glorify God for the obedience of your confession unto the gospel of Christ, and for the liberality of `your' contribution unto them and unto all; 9:14 while they themselves also, with supplication on your behalf, long after you by reason of the exceeding grace of God in you. I believe 2 Corinthians 9:6-14 offers a better model for giving and even though I tithe, I base my theology of giving on this scripture. You might ask the question: Why do I tithe? I tithe out of obligation and expectation. The members, specifically the officers and even my episcipal leaders expect me to tithe because I am a minister. Do I give cheerfully? Yes, because I give unto God, but in my heart I feel that giving should just be more spiritual--a deeper act of worship, than just mere obedience and ritual. I came across an interesting article today about how a pastor of a mega-church teaches tithing. I have attached the artice below:
The Tithing ChallengeWhy one church offers its members a money-back guarantee.By Ron Benson | | Pastor Craig Groeschel |
Testing God is usually discouraged by pastors and churches. After all, there are pretty good reasons for avoiding the practice. In Matthew 4:7 Jesus quotes from Deuteronomy: "It is also written: 'Do not put the Lord your God to the test.'" In the book of Acts, after discovering some questionable donations, the apostle Peter asks a woman named Sapphira, "How could you agree to test the Spirit of the Lord?" The consequences of her actions were not pleasant. But LifeChurch.tv, a multi-site, media-intensive church out of Oklahoma City, encourages testing God. They not only advocate such testing, they back it up with an unorthodox guarantee. Senior Pastor Craig Groeschel refers his congregation to Malachi 3:10, where God challenges His people to bring a tithe—ten percent of their income—to Him. "Test me in this," He tells Israel. "It's the only place in all of Scripture where we are given permission to test God," says Groeschel. "If you want to test Him, we'll give you the chance." LifeChurch.tv calls it the "Three-Month Tithing Challenge." Participants commit, via the Internet, to tithe to the church for three months. If at the end of the challenge participants are not convinced of God's faithfulness, they can get a full refund of all they have given. According to Groeschel, "If something didn't work out for you, you contact the church, we'll cut you a check for every penny you gave." Pastor Groeschel initiated the tithe challenge 11 years ago. He is careful to tell his congregations, "I don't ever want anyone to hear the message that you give to get, because that's not why we give. But the bottom line is when you are faithful to God, He blesses you in ways that maybe are financial, or that are much more important than your finances." Does it work? Ask Cathi Linch, senior executive of finance for LifeChurch.tv. "I love the tithe challenge. Over the years I've heard so many stories—great stories of how God came through." The church of 20,000 gathers at 11 locations across the country, and a satellite video link provides each campus with Pastor Craig's sermon every week. While the tithe challenge is available for new givers anytime, a recent message about tithing inspired 550 individuals to sign up. When the three months are over, says Linch, most people continue to give not because they have to, or because they've signed up for it, but because they have a desire that springs from the inside. "Giving is not a chore, but a privilege," she says.   |  | "Tithing is the only place in Scripture where we are given permission to test God."—Craig Groeschel | |   |
Dave, a doctor in the church, had never tithed before. He struggled with the decision—not only had he never given that much money, he brought down a salary that would make 10 percent a big bite. But he took the challenge. When he sat down with his accountant to work out his taxes that year, his refund equaled the exact amount he had tithed. Not everyone has a positive experience. In the four years since Linch has been on the job, she's handled ten refunds. From the recent big push, five participants out of the 550 who signed up requested their tithe be returned. "Some offer an explanation for why they're asking for their money back, but we write them their check, no questions asked. The issues are between the giver and God." The vast majority of those who agree to put God to the test find that He passes with flying colors. Kelli is a single mom who receives only sporadic child support payments, and she's struggling to make it. "I was arguing with myself over tithing. I had no idea how I was going to make it the next two weeks without that ten percent." But Kelli wrote the check anyway. Concerned later that she may have overdrawn her account, she checked her balance and discovered that a child support payment had posted the same day, putting her in the black sufficiently to make it to the next paycheck. "I know that God does not always work this way, but right now I needed a thing like this." Pastor Groeschel sees the tithe as an act of worship and trust. "Go on and test Him," he says, "and see if you will not be drawn to God in an awesome way."
For More info, visit www.LifeChurch.tv.
Copyright © 2007 by the author or Christianity Today International/Today's Christian magazine.
Click here for reprint information.July/August 2007, Vol. 45, No. 4, page 14
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| To add a comment to "Tithing" |
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| September 29, 2008 |
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revstarr,
What a most thought provoking subject we have here. I wanted to quote you here... "Yes( I tithe), because I give unto God, but in my heart I feel that giving should just be more spiritual--a deeper act of worship, than just mere obedience and ritual."
This is why I don't spend much time talking to the church about this matter. Other than to tell you all that Mrs. Webb and I do tithe. Why do we? It is a deep personal thing for us. I think we started out with the mindset that we would test the Lord. But now, it is just part of who we are in our relationship with the Lord.
I will try my best not to be cynical here but I would never make this promise like Pastor Craig. I might challenge the folk to test the Lord for awhile but would make no other promises. A church this size is not really challenged here and, forgive me if I offend anyone, I believe they are using the people money. If several hundred tithes for 3 months and that money goes to the bank. What happens? Interest. If that several hundred tithers give a good sum that will add up. My question is, what happens to that interest? As far as I can tell, they only give back what the people gave?
Help me understand someone. |
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| September 29, 2008 |
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| Pastor, I appreciate your thoughts on this issue. I just wish people would see giving as an act of worship, not just ritual. The Lord deserves our very best in all things--giving included. I agree with you about the pastor in this article--For starters, the Lord is not an ATM! I don't worship Jesus for the fringe benefits. I worship my savior because I adore him with my entire being. |
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| September 29, 2008 |
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| Starr, I really like your balanced views on this topic. I too don't see any clear admonitions in the NT, or for Gentiles, to tithe. But perhaps the Lord calls some to give more than 10%....individually that is. Any gift motivated by the Holy Spirit is a beautiful thing! |
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| September 29, 2008 |
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Mike,
"Any gift motivated by the Holy Spirit is a beautiful thing!" --- That is my point exactly. Old school teaching on tithing can cripple the giver and even place limits on how much the giver feels they should give. I believe that whatever the gift--1% or 50%, we should worship the giver of all good gifts(Jesus) while we are doing it. |
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| September 30, 2008 |
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| Starr: I agree with you. Thithing is a principle and not a commandment. I don't see how you can't be blessed when you give to God. If we are to get down to it, God requires everything and He own everything, therefore our money is His and not ours. So, in some cases 10% may be undercutting God, but in other cases it may be too much of a strain on someone. The important thing is to give as the Lord has blessed you. Who of us can say that we are not blessed? We are blessed with every spiritual blessings in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus. Jesus gave everything for us, why should we not give everything to Him. I say, follow the Lord and if He says to test Him in this and see...then we ought to test Him in this and see. As for the Christian though if he or she is not giving they are in direct violation of the Scripture. How much and how often, that is an issue of conscience to give as the Lord leads. The question is how obedient will people be? I think most Pastors and church leaders can't trust their people to give more than the tithe so they set the bar at the tithe to make sure they get at least that much. You can't out give God though. No matter what we give, He returns to us in more ways than just money. So, there you have it......my opinion, my 2 cents worth...like the widow's mite. LOL |
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| September 30, 2008 |
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Good morning revstarr,
As much as I love the structure of methodism, I think that is what happens sometimes. We get caught up in the rituals(color me guilty) and forget that Jesus taught a message of compassion. That even spills to our act of giving. |
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| September 30, 2008 |
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WOW! What a thought provoking, bold, and courageous statement to make!!! I do agree with you that in the NT there is no mention of tithing. My testimony has been this: God has blessed due to me sowing. I have been convicted by the Holy Spirit that when I did tithe that I was not tithing out of obedience to the Law, but I was tithing out of obedience to the set man of God that was my pastor at that time. The thing about that is this, you begin to be obedient to a man than be obedient to Christ.
I say again, "WOW" this is food for thought...when the Lord give you an answer to this one please share with me-I'm interested to know what the Lord has to say concerning this! |
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| September 30, 2008 |
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What a Mighty Counselor, Oh how Excellent is He! do not give out of necessity, or out of wantonness, but give out of a cheerful heart...for the LORD loves a cheerful giver.....and remember the LORD WILL never put on you more than you can bear.....the widow women gave all that she had....above and beyond the tithe....she gave with a heart of love, trusting in the GOD of her salvation.....oh how GOD is seeking a people who would worship Him in spirit and in truth. Praise GOD my Sista, thank you for posting this awesome blog.......Love Sis Darla |
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| September 30, 2008 |
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Todd-Your thoughts and two cents are worth spending! Thanks. I believe you are right: as minister's we strive to get members to do what we can and a tithe is often better than nothing; even if it in my opinion is "entry-level" giving.
Pastor--Well..we are methodist, what can I say? I will give out of my love to Jesus and tithe..all I can do.
Ladell- We agree in the spirit.
Dy--thanks for sharing with me, my new friend, you are indeed wise. |
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| September 30, 2008 |
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A visiting pastor from Pasadena, California spoke briefly to my church last Sunday about the tithing in relation to another issue, "Sacred Work".
He talked about the different views on tithing and offerings (OT view of 10% and NT view that all belongs to God). To those that do not cheerfully give anything to God because they work hard to earn "their money" and times are tough, he asked us to look at it this way.
He said our God is such a gracious and loving God and everything belongs to Him...(Every good and perfect gift comes down from the Father of Lights in whom there is no variableness or shadow of turning.
If we can grasp and understand the measure of God's great generosity toward us, we would see that since everything is God's, He is so good to us that he lets us keep 90% of our earnings and and only keeps 10% for his work. Of course, those that give more and live simply live in much freedom (from debt, from bondage, etc)
. This is a great way of looking at it...as we are all on a journey to being more and more like Christ...Our journey is to get to heaven...and in doing so to also help others get there...Our journey on earth is not about storing treasures on earth or seeking out lives of pleasure for pleasure's sake (though some of us get to do that too). Ultimately if God is not at the centre of everything, we only find emptiness and longing for more as he created us to have "eternity in our hearts". God help us to be "cheerful givers" and "doers of the Word and not hearers only". Great word, sister (sorry for calling u brother earlier - sheepish grin) :-) |
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| October 01, 2008 |
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| Joyful Servant- Thanks. I agree, we should all strive to be cheerful givers, honoring the Lord with everything. Jesus is just so deserving. I love him so much for so many reasons. I count it an abiding joy that Jesus calls me friend and chooses me as servant. |
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| October 01, 2008 |
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Wow Starr, you hit on something here!! I feel alot the same as you. I remember in my old church it was pushed and pushed preached and taught about tithing and 10% where it almost felt like you were beat down if you didnt give. So many families struggled and being that is was as small a church as it was there was basically 3-4 families that was the main source of financial and mine was one. I was also the one who was in charge of counting and doing bills at the end. I saw so many people the Pastor's wife for one who would preach and teach and beat you over the head with Tithing and so would one of the ministers and they would rarely tithe themselves. The Pastor's wife would put IOU's in the offering! One day I took it in to her to cash it in so to speak and she said oh I forgot I dont have my check book I went yeah Good thing Jesus Paid his Debt in Full, and not with an IOU, Huh??? She just laughed.
But I for one believe to look at the persons heart just as God does. I remember one time I had no money but I knew I had put my time in at the church working and worshipping God so when it came time to give I just Placed myself in the basket. I used to do that when I took up the offering I told the people if you dont have to give in the finacial just give of yourself!! I used to see the smiles on their faces when they did. One man I know was not going to go to a service cause he had nothing to give and didnt want to hear it come over the pulpit. I told him Shame on him for letting them steal his blessing! What did you do for the Lord today? Did you give him time in worship and in prayer He said yes I said then Go to the Church you already gave to the Lord!!! He thanked me the next day and said He was truly blessed by the service and he even testified about what I had said to him!!
Praise God Starr for what you are sharing here!! I cant wait to see what more people say |
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| October 01, 2008 |
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You never know it's gone. It's our way of giving back to God. Plus... it just feels good. |
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| October 02, 2008 |
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beauty--Thanks my sister. Our hearts are one with this issue.
Joey--I am pleased to hear your comment and to know that tithing is something that ministers to your heart.
Prophet--I will certainly read your link and I agree giving was never meant to be about money. |
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