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| Business owners??...should we tithe on our business??? |
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Ok, so I understand that we tithe on the gross of our paychecks, however.....if you own your own business, then do you tithe on the gross of your business income as well???...I mean, would that be like tithing twice....being that, i pay myself my paycheck from the inital gross business income???...ok....for instance, lets say my business brings in $1000 in a week....and i tithe $100.....but then i pay myself $300 from that thousand.....and i tithe $30 on that too....can anybody help me???......thanks in advance!!!......amalyn |
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Hey Amanda,
Allow me to talk to you from the standpoint of business and what I did in the past when I had a Computer Shop in Tennessee. Being that you are both the business and the person responsible for producing the income. I believe that if you tithe of your business gross profit (not income) then the monies you pay yourself have already had the FICA, FED, and Tithe taken prior to issuance of your net pay... get it? I don't see a need to tithe again on income that you have already tithed on being that it is coming from and to the same source; namely, you.
I hope that helps...
In Christ,
Pastor W. |
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| THANKS PASTOR!!!!.........that's exactly what i have been doing!!!!.....that and offerings as well.......thanks again!!!! |
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Another question on thithing...
Soooo... if I make $3,000 a week (I wish!) and after taxes I bring home just $2,000, should I tithe $300 or $200?
I would think $200 because that is what I bring home. I do not see the $1,000 that goes (without asking permission lol) to cover the require government taxes. Others might disagree saying that what I make is what is in paper before taxes, not what I receive after taxes. Then, what would be the correct tithing amount?
Hey, I know our church does not promote tithing as a law or as a requirement for salvation, thank God! We give according to how much we have received from God, and as an act of thanksgiving. I just personally consider "Godly Stewardship" a very important Christian practice, but I've never stopped long enough to really understand the why's and the how's. OK, blame Amanda... She started it ;-)
Lourdes
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LOL!!!!......ok, i'll take the blame....but actually, i believe we are supposed to tithe on our gross pay.......which would be the $3,000......i'm not sure, so we will have to ask the master......i mean, pastor!!!!!.......lol |
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Cathy |
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June 15, 2007 at 10:16am |
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Great subject.
When you are blessed, bless God. No math formula needed. |
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| GOOD POINT!!!!!!!!.......AMEN |
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Bill |
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June 15, 2007 at 10:34am |
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| We should tithe the gross pay and not the take home because if we tithe after taxes we are giving our firstfruits to man and not to God. |
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Cathy, I just realized this was a public blog. Sorry! My comment/question was really put together with our local church in mind, but your answer was great as always. Thank you!!!
I was a little disapointed because I was expecting one of your funny comments ;-)
Lourdes |
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Cathy |
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June 15, 2007 at 10:44am |
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I work here at Calvary Community Church. I wish I could let people know how much it costs to keep the lights on and pay the electric bill.
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Lourdes I agree totally with the first part of your statement on tithing. I used to tithe on the gross (thinking I was being spiritual), however your assessment is correct mine was wrong. The point you made is extremely good. What has happened is that the cankerworm has eaten a certain amount of the crop (the cankerworm clearly being the government and other parasites), and we need to tithe on the increase, only. Now, it must be pointed out that Jesus in no way rescinded the tithe but rather commended the Pharissees for tithing even to the point of mint and cummin but his rebuke was on their lack of giving with the right motivation. BTW, tithe means 10% we are required to give this but he really owns it all. Some "financial experts" have made comments like, "when you decide what per cent of your tithe you want to give"...I won't name names. No, tithe means 1/10 or 10%. Now, IMNSHO and Biblically, this is the bare minimum...but, again, I suggest people tithe on the net NOT the gross. Tithe after the cankerworm and then, if you get tax money back at the end of the year, tithe on that as well.  |
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Bill, We have no choice (other than to vote scoundrels out of office) on the gross. This money, is in essence STOLEN from us. The firstfruits to us is the NET. Think about it! |
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Dr. W. I don't understand your original post. Did you say it the way you meant to? If so, I need some clarification because I'm not sure what you are saying! |
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Bill, you said "if we tithe after taxes we are giving our firstfruits to man and not to God." I never saw it that way. Thanks.
Hey, I am the first to confess I am horrible when it comes to # numbers :-( That is my husband's department. We tithe together and he makes sure is done correctly ;-) I don't have to worry about it! I've being more concern of my right attitude in my offering because thithing was never an issue.
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Cathy |
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June 15, 2007 at 11:03am |
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This is such an awesome blog.
I think about what I do with the other 90%. It gives me a better understanding of why I should give more. |
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| You are right Cathy, but does God wants more than 10% when it comes to tithing? That is way I enjoy offerring (in addition to tithing), because I am not limited to a %. I can give without having a calculator in my purse ;-) I can freely give more to our local church, ministries, and mission. I try to see tithing as an act of obedience and offering as an act of thanksgiving. I know I can never outgive God, but I should try to be a financial blessing to my local church and others. |
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| Tithe means 1/10 or ten percent, 10%, that is the minimum. Agreed on the local church! |
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Tithing on business income is very difficult. It depends on the business, I will agree. If you are a very small business and have a reasonably predictable cashflow, then you can tithe as is you are receiving a pay check. My business is nothing like that. I have always asked those who wanted to make the tithe a legalistic methodology to follow to answer these questions:
1. If I take a stipend out of my business, do I tithe on that? If so, why don't I just take an extra 10% out to cover the tithe as if it were simply another bill?
2. If I don't take a salary from my business, but I do take enough to cover my basic living expenses, do I tithe on that?
3. If I do figure out how to tithe on the business, how often do I do it? I run monthly books, but report income on a yearly basis. Some months are positive. Some are negative cashflow. Do I only tithe on the positive cashflow months? That doesn't really make sense because the positive cashflow of one month is used to pay back the negative cashflow of earlier months. How about quarterly? How about annually? Actually, if I am running my businesses correctly, I will have no income from them so I have no taxes to pay from the business. So, do I only tithe on the money I personally pay tax on? What happens if one year I suffer a significant loss and it takes me five years to recover (I have been there)?
4. I fully understand that if I use $1000 to start my business, then when I sell it I clear $10,000, then I would tithe on the $9,000. That isn't a problem, but what if my second business is running negative and I need that money to cover that business' negative cashflow (the negative cashflow was the primary reason for selling the first business)? That $10,000 certainly isn't an increase for me. Since I have several businesses, this is very often the case.
As long as one has a very simplistic income structure, then the tithing teachings in the church today work. Now, I employ many people who get a paycheck every other week and, assuming they don't have other income, then they can decide to tithe from the gross or the net...whichever. I believe it is a heart matter between you and God.
However, if we are going to be legalistic about it, shouldn't we tithe on Christmas and birthday presents? What about the increase in our 401K? Should we tithe on that? It may have a decrease next year, so what do we do then? Goes back to the question about how often we tithe. What about the increase in our home value? Tithe when we sell it? Or do we tithe only on what we don't use for the next home we buy. Say we buy a home for $50,000, then sell it for $100,000. Seems to me we should tithe on the $50,000. However, most of us use that $100,000 as a down payment on a new home and never consider that a personal increase.
I say all this to say that it is not easy to determine what to tithe. People can make up rules, but the rules end up being as large of a code as the tax code. I personally think we give until we give sacrificially. The tithe is a good guideline, but don't stop there. Give as much as you can. |
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| WOW.......i never knew there were so many angles to look at this.....thanks everybody!!!! |
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Cathy |
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June 15, 2007 at 12:35pm |
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Here is something funny I heard once.
This lady says " I give my money to World Relief, Compassion Child etc...etc...., rather than tithe at my church."
Then someone says back to her " When you need someone to pray for you at the hospital or someone to do a wedding or funeral, who from World Relief is going to show up for you to do that?"
I thought that was funny !! |
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| Good one! Our priority should be our local church ;-) |
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JJ |
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June 22, 2007 at 5:50pm |
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It seems to me that God tells us to Tithe, not because he needs the money, but to develop our character... All the dollars and cents don't matter at all, it is our character he is worried about. But that being said we should also try to make sure that the Church can sustain itself, so that it can bring more people to Christ. 10% is a starting point in my opinion and it will develop from there as our character grows closer to God. First Fruits, seems to mean to me to be right off the top. Afterall taxes are just another bill. It is voluntary, we could move to another country if we don't want to pay... When the character is right the giving will follow appropriately. I still have a long way to go... Cheers JJ |
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| Interesting points DC. My first inclination is that we tithe on our income after taxes. I would think that the business would fall into income at some point, but is not a business usually a separate coroporation from which we give ourselves a profit and/or salary? |
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JJ, try not paying the taxes and see how voluntary it is! I know, they are called contributions, but how many people really are voluntarily giving these contributions??? Same thing for our homes. We say we own them but try not paying the taxes on them and see who owns them!! I do agree though that it is about character AND obedience! |
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| yes recon, your business should be considered separate, however, i am my only employee, therefore all the income is generated by myself.....if i don't work, there is no business income...therefore no salary.......and jj is right too.....God knew what He was doing....because our tithe does sustain the church......thanks for the comments!!! |
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Recon77, because of the tax laws in this country, the best business (from a business perspective) is one that loses $1 each year. Sure the IRS will audit you, but so what. If I am investing my money, my business value grows and my cashflow is steady. I just don't ever show any income to the business because it gets reinvested. I tend to pull out just enough to pay my basic bills and pay taxes on that money. It is pretty easy to pull out an additional 10% as a tithe, but then it becomes simply another expense and I know that isn't what God wants. He wants sacrificial giving, so I don't like the rules. I like the challenges of the heart that force me to trust in God for wisdom to run the business and to make good business choices. For example, if pulling 10% out means I have to lay off a person or two, then that isn't sacrificial to me and it makes no sense. Don't get me wrong, if I thought I had heard from God to do it, I would - to obey is better than sacrifice - but, in this case, it is usually better to provide an income to two families who may or may not tithe than to be legalistic myself.
So far, the fruits show I am doing ok. Only a reflection on my God and not on me. TGBTG forever and always. |
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Steve |
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July 16, 2007 at 7:00am |
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DC,
I am confused by what you are saying here. Here is what it sounds like to me, but maybe I am missing something.
It sounds like you are saying you only take the bare minimum out of your businessess to support your lifestyle and keep all the rest of the growth (profit?) reinvesting to help your business grow. You don't give a tithe from the increase of the business, instead you consider the challenge of trusting God to give you wisdom to make good business decisions to be your giving? And you consider the fact that your business is growing to be proof that God is pleased with this approach.
Is this what you are saying here? Help me understand. |
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