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Belief's Opposing Force - Part 3
||December 01, 2008|416 reads
 

To add a comment to "Belief's Opposing Force - Part 3"
Jimmie
December 01, 2008
Well done!!! It is my very humble opinion that you have revelation in this area Michael.I heard "faith","belief" and "unbelief"preached and explained before,but never with such clarity. Your understanding shows"maturity".
Rob
December 02, 2008
Michael,

Once again, my brother, you have hit a home run.  Please keep these great teachings coming.  They serve to challenge my faith.

You quoted Mark 9 where the man brings his demon possessed son to Jesus.  The man actually insults Jesus when he said, "If thou canst do anything..."  The  KJV is not as clear as the NIV is in this passage.  The word "if" is a powerful word of unbelief.  The NIV shows Jesus' reaction to the man's doubt, "If  you can?  All things are possible to them that believe." (or words to that effect).

Satan tempted Jesus in the wilderness with the word "if".  "If thou be the Son of God, command that these stones be made bread."  And again, "Ifthou be the Son of God, cast thyself down [from the pinnacle of the temple]".  Later on, at Jesus' crucifixion, the crowd said, "If He be the king of Israel, let Him come down from the cross and we will believe Him."  The word "if" casts doubt on who Jesus is and what He came to do.

You rightly point out that it is important for us to understand the will of God, otherwise we will be left guessing.  This is the condition of the modern church.  In the area of healing, the church is guessing whether it is the will of God that people should be well.  Satan has deceived the church into believing that God wants them sick (or worse, God made them sick).  They fail to understand because they fail to believe.  Before we can understand the things of God we have to first believe them:
11:3 Through faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear.

If we don't believe that the worlds were framed by the word of God, then we will never understand that principle even if we read it in God's word.  By the same token, given the preponderance of evidence to the contrary the people of God are still scratching their heads wondering if God wants them healed or sick.  If they first believed that God wants them to be in good health then it would be easy for them to gather enough evidence from the scriptures to support that belief.

4:3 Forbidding to marry, [and commanding] to abstain from meats, which God hath created to be received with thanksgiving of them which believe and know the truth.

Knowledge follows belief.

Unbelief is belief.  You have made that point.  When people believe false things about God, they will find enough evidence in the word of God to support their "belief".  The bible is a collection of words on pages.  The key to understanding, however, is faith in the goodness of God.  Anything else renders the words on those pages powerless.

Rob

December 02, 2008
Rob,

Excellent points you made indeed. I almost chose to use the NLT version of Mark 9 when I first posted. I love Jesus' reply in that version.  “What do you mean, ‘If I can’?” Jesus asked. “Anything is possible if a person believes.”  It's like He was saying, "Who do you think you're talking to pal?"

It's really a shame that most people will not let the Word of God get in the way of what they believe, or disbelieve. The church has pounded so much untruth into theirs heads for years and years and years that it becomes almost impossible to convince them that in the eyes of God they are holy and without blame. Sometimes we just have to demolish the walls we have previously constructed, jackhammer the foundation and then start all over again.

I heard a story about a young boy who had a very, very rough childhood. His parents were dirt poor and were alcoholics on top of that. This kid hardly went to school as most of the time he had no clothes to wear and often would spend weeks at a time in his room in his underwear and nothing to eat. Well, this kid turned out to be a very serious drug addict in his teens and eventually fried his brain. I mean really fried it to the point where he had no memory of the past whatsoever. He didn't even know his own name or where he came from. So he ended up in a mental ward.

So this mental case kid who had absolutely no identity, somehow got hold of a bible and started reading about Jesus. And since he had no idea who he was himself he decided that he would become like Jesus. To make a long story shorter, this kid was indeed born-again and today he supposedly pastors a church of 10,000 people and personally donates over $40,000 a month to outreach programs for the mentally impaired.

I am still trying to find out this guy's name cause I would love to learn more of his story. But my point is that, O, would we all lose our identity as to who we once were and rediscover ourselves as God sees us, spiritually blessed.

God chose us to be disciples and the last thing He needs is a bunch of sick people on His staff. My employer pays my health insurance premium as well as the premiums for the rest of the company, and I am grateful for that. You know why they do that? So that we can remain healthy and not miss work. Productivity (good works) is key to any successful operation and it is absolutely necessary that people actually show up for work if indeed we plan on making profits (bear fruit).

God paid my health insurance premium in full forever as the very moment Jesus released his spirit. Now God says, "Get up out of that bed young man, you have work to do"

Gotta run for now...I have an earthly health insurance premium to earn!

Later
Loriinfj
December 02, 2008
A very great precise blog Michael....very eloquently put...

I will say this it truly pains me to see people trapped in the sea of unbelief...you needn't talk to them long to know they are there...I think at some point in our life we all have struggled with unbelief of some sort, such as: Do you believe the Word of God to be absolute truth, does God really own the cattle on 1000 hills, is He truly working actively to bring about good things in our life, did He really commission us to do GREATER things than He did, are we truly the righteousness of Christ....

See, to me we all have to adjust our thinking to the way God thinks...and it is very different than how the human brain thinks...the more we read the Word the more we soak it in and the more we are converted to Gods way of thinking...It is a process...for me I know I have come to really know the Lord more and more every year I have been alive...and I know Him so differently than I have before...

He truly is to me my provider, my healer, and my redeemer and I honestly feel like He runs right along side of me encouraging me to run this race before me with gusto, in fact I believe He empowers me to do just that. 

Our belief system truly affects our faith and our belief system can block us from the loving-kindness of  Christ
If you believeyour a wretched rag and deserve nothing then you won't believe the promises that Christ has offered us as Christians and you will stay that wretched rag...but what is important to know is that there are all kinds of promises Christ has offered to us for us to be victorious in THIS life.  Satan, the church, and many other believers will talk and even shout out what Jesus did for us and what He did not....and it has gotten to the point in American churches that just about all people believe in what He DID NOT do...I don't see a victorious life being preached from the pulpit much...and it saddens me because there truthfully is so much more...

Many people don't want to step on toes, they don't want to challenge their brother or sister in Christ to look up to the Creator...I hear all the time how dare we judge another Christians level of faith when they have a dying child etc.,  or they themselves have a terminal diagnosis....but isn't it more of a shame to let those people stay right there and give them no hope but that God will be with them after their baby dies, or that even though they are going to leave children behind they will be in heaven...You know Jesus did not let one child pass this life when their parents came to him for healing, a few had already died and he brought them back from death..and why do we see those examples in the Word?  He also healed all that came to Him....I believe to give us the knowledge that it is not His will our children die or us before our time.  Jesus is the same, yesterday, today, and tomorrow what He did as an example then He will surly do now...you just have to really know Him and believe on who He is...and you have to know those promises and learn to walk in them.  This is certainly not the way the world thinks and worldly views have infiltrated our churches and affected our congregations and they have affected many of us....I just ask, when, when will the CHURCH see Christ for what he did and who He is? When will people see Gods heart and understand His loving-kindness to us? When will people stop attributing what Satan (kill, steal and destroy) does to God?  GOD IS GOOD AND HE IS GOOD ALL THE TIME....if what people believe really does not line up with that then they have a BAD belief system...because the Word is true....let everyman be shown a liar over that Word....May God heal our hearts and guide us into believing on Him once again....
Craig
December 02, 2008

Hi Michael, everyone:

My favorite example that points to the presence of faith and unbelief (e.g. doubt or double-mindedness) in the same context is the example of Peter walking on the water.  A counter example that the presence of contrary circumstances isn’t an indication of the presence of doubt or unbelief is Abraham contemplating the deadness of Sarah’s womb and the deadness of his own body.  We can look at the circumstances as long as we are looking through them to the One who promised.

Some faith teachers go back to the King James interpretation of this verse but the Greek is quite clear; out problem is that we aren’t 13th Century Englishman so we just don’t get the syntax and rules of grammar that applied back then.

Romans 4:19-22 ( ESV ) 19He did not weaken in faith when he considered his own body, which was as good as dead (since he was about a hundred years old), or when he considered the barrenness of Sarah’s womb20No distrust made him waver concerning the promise of God, but he grew strong in his faith as he gave glory to God,  21fully convinced that God was able to do what he had promised.  22That is why his faith was “counted to him as righteousness.” 

So, for me, what is actually written trumps any faith teacher…including Kenneth Copeland or even Andrew Wommack.  J It should also be pointed out that faith is one of the gifts of the Spirit and it also “comes.”  Additionally the definite article (e.g. the) is not in the Greek in the following verse.

Romans 12:3-8 ( ESV ) 3For by the grace given to me I say to everyone among you not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think, but to think with sober judgment, each according to the measure of faith that God has assigned4For as in one body we have many members,£ and the members do not all have the same function,  5so we, though many, are one body in Christ, and individually members one of another.  6Having gifts that differ according to the grace given to us, let us use them: if prophecy, in proportion to our faith;  7if ser-vice, in our serving; the one who teaches, in his teaching;  8the one who exhorts, in his exhortation; the one who contributes, in generosity; the one who leads,£ with zeal; the one who does acts of mercy, with cheerfulness.

Romans 10:17 ( ESV ) 17So faith comes from hearing, and hearing through the word of Christ.
Faith comes: not from reading the scriptures, but from hearing.  Hearing comes through the [rhema: spoken word] of Christ.  Those are the verses that come alive to us by the Holy Spirit; the faith comes with that living word.  Derek Prince has a great little book that speaks too much of this called Faith to Live By.  For me, all the scriptures that speak to the subject have to be logically “and” before were going to see what is being said.  I know what various faith teachers say about “the” measure of faith and all that, but it just doesn’t line up—in my understanding—with all the other verses that speak to the subject.  The verse may also be literally translated: “So faith comes from hearing and hearing from the word anointed.”  Christ is literally the Greek word for “anointed.”  There is no definite article that indicates “the” anointed here.
I think that we can almost make a god out of faith if we are not careful.  Jesus is its author and its perfecter; it comes though grace and its object is always God and his word.  I also understand that we can believe in sickness and the power of the enemy more than we believe in what God has done about them.  Andrew Wommack speaks very well to those subjects and it matches what I have seen in my own Christian experience.  To believe in the devil and his power is actually worth-ship and actually empowers the demonic.  If you’ve ever meant Christians who exclusively focus on the demonic you’ll see lots of manifestations of the demonic around them.  The emotion of fear is actually a giveaway of what we believe in our heart with respect to the demonic and especially some sicknesses like cancer.  Fear is a valid and natural response that we have when facing our own weakness in the face of things that are greater than we are, but our response is to set our minds on, and fear, the One who is greater than all these other fears.  As Andrew says, many of us have “missed the parade” mentioned in Colossians 2:13-15 and Colossians 1:13 where domain is the Greek exousia, meaning: power, authority, or jurisdiction (G1849) of darkness.  So do we actually believe in our hearts that that is true of us?

Sincerely,
Craig

P.S. Lori, great point: we are transformed by the renewal of our minds!  Rob, like that "unbelief is belief."  Great blog Michael!

Jimmie
December 02, 2008
Traditions and Customs have replaced almost everything Jesus taught against!!! God's Word will "build,fortify and sustain belief",when studied,meditated on and applied to ones life"!!Praying for understanding is also away to make belief well founded!!! I hope soon to write a blog entry on things that"the"church has made a tradition or custom of.
Craig
December 02, 2008

Sigh...thanks for the re-formatting MyChurch.  :-)  Wish they had an "edit" function for our own posts!!!

Yeah, Jimmie: almost everything is a "tradition" and unfortunately we don't judge our traditions by the scriptures but the scriptures by our traditions...and we end up teaching as doctrines the precepts of men.  Hummm...where have we seen that mentioned?  :-)

Craig 

Rob
December 02, 2008
You guys are a hoot!  And Lori, I can't tell you how much I love what you have written.  I can feel your passion coming through the Internet.  It's like reading the words of Jesus when He said, "O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, how I have longed to gather you as a hen gathers her chicks"  (or words to that effect).  We who have been given the revelation that God is good can't wait till others hear it too.  And it absolutely TURNS OUR CRANKS to hear influential people speak against the goodness of God.

Craig, I dig your cool font and stuff in your comment up there.  Not only that but I hear what you're saying.  Abraham indeed considered the "deadness of Sarah's womb" but in the face of crummy circumstance, he chose instead to believe in the promise of God.  Faith is a gift, no doubt, but more than that, faith is a choice.

Lori said:

"Many people don't want to step on toes, they don't want to challenge their brother or sister..."

MichaelATL43 made me promise that I wouldn't throw barbs on his turf so I won't but I think I've issued my share of personal challenges.  There are a total of four of us who have been given the revelation that God is good and circumstance is not necessarily of God (i.e. Just because we can see it doesn't mean it's necessarily God's will).  But there are hundreds of people on MyChurch who have no concept of a good God.  To most, good means bad and bad means good.

For example: if I say I love my wife but I have to beat her every now and then because I love her so much, what would you think of me?  But if we assign that kind of abuse to God, then it's quite alright.  If any American treated people the way the church teaches that God treats people, that sucker'd be in jail - not heaven.  In other words, evil is good if God is doing it.

Michael, if you had 200 readers of your blog, would you have the kind of reception that certain others on MyChurch have?  As I think about it... I don't think you would.  Most people don't want to hear that God cares about them.  Most people don't want to learn how to get the kingdom of God to work for them.  It screws up their theology.

I'm ramblin' again,
Rob
Craig
December 02, 2008

Hey Rob...all you have to remember is that the truth isn't enough.  :-)  It has to be the truth spoken in love [agape]. Truth without love can't be handled by us unless we are walking by the Spirit. Notice that Paul did not correct the brother that believed eating meat sacrificed to idols was a sin; rather he corrected those that knew the truth! And said "not all have this knowledge."  See 1 Corinthians 8.  :-)  Ask yourself why he didn't hammer the guy without the knowledge...and then think about how we didn't always know what we do right now.  :-)

Craig

Craig
December 02, 2008
Ok, and I still want MyChurch to add emoticons!  <smile> <big smile> <laughing> <wink> <sigh> <frown> etc.
Loriinfj
December 02, 2008
Rob those were really kind words...I appreciate that...and your right it totally "turns my crank" when I hear of others that don't truly believe in the goodness of God..not all the time, or not for this situation, or that person...How sad is that...I'm so tired of people missing Gods best for them and all for a doctrine....I'm just shaking my head here...

Rob, I personally love how bold you are and how you challenge others to think...it should be that way...I think the thing that has made us all feel bad is the finger wagging in our face telling us to back down...BACK DOWN from the truth?  Are you kidding me?  From a truth that will set others free that I personally have walked in?  A joke right? OK, now when it comes to that....I'm not backing down...just like I know you guys are not either...

Craig you are so right about walking in love, you have a way of putting things that is so swallowable to others, even others that disagree with you honor you....I don't think I have quite that knack...but you truly have a gift in diplomacy....<big smile> <laughing> <the yes nod>

Michael...what can I say publicly...you know I KNOW you to be awesome...and if it were not for your influence I wouldn't be here typing right now...I'd be in bed....exhausted and so tired I wouldn't know if I could do this again tomorrow....thanks for walking this out with me....sometimes even I am at a loss of words as to how to fully express my appreciation....you take me right there...

You guys are great...and I look forward to seeing you each and every day....In Him, Lori