Denise, Kathy, Marcella, Toni...thanks for reading!

Mary (mstovall), what would Jesus do? Well, he encountered many "sinners", even hung out and supped with a few. I don't recall him pointing out their sins too often though. Am I wrong? I do recall him saying "Go and sin no more" a few times. But I don't think he assumed the role of calling out specific sins. He even let an adultress off the hook when the religious leaders wanted to give her just rewards. 

Amen Terry (and Yvelisse). Some may argue that God's love has some conditions, but why must mine???

Joey, you have a charming way of loving people!

YPM, great points! The goodness of God is what really captivated me!! Now that's an attractive motivator!

Tyler, great comment, thanks!! Good point too, we were all born with an orientation toward sin. (sadly)

Tee Tow, what a wonderful testimony! And thanks for the friend request!!

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However, I do want to address another issue and that is the idea that one sin is not worse than another. 

First, some sins have greater punishment than others. For instance the expression "a great sin" (Exodus 32:21,30,31) and "a very great sin" (1 Samuel 2:17)? What is the meaning of Isaiah 8:6 where "great abominations" are compared with "greater abominations"? If one is greater, how could that be any thing but a different "degree" of sin?

Jesus spoke of the weightier matters of the law in Matthew 23:15. What does that mean if some matters are not weightier? If so, what is that but a different degree of weight?

Very closely connected, but relating to a different subject are those who will receive "greater condemnation" (Cf. Mt. 23:14; Mark 12:40; Luke 20:47; James 3:1).

If there remains the slightest question about the fact that some sins are greater than others, Jesus' statement in John 19:11 should forever remove it. "He that delivered me unto thee hath the GREATER SIN."

Cubbie - amen!! Clanging symbol...yep! Loud, annoying, and offensive, LOL!

As for greater/lesser sins, who can argue w/the word of God? Granted all sins equally divide us from God, requiring the sacrifice of the perfect Lamb (e.g. James 2:10). But definitely seems some sins grieve the heart of God more than others.

Sis Cece, I'm sure she knew your love was genuine! In fact, that's the ONLY way I see you having any influence in her life, or anyone's, is to be genuine with them!!

Hi Sue...thanks!!

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If our GoOD Lord did not condemn people while he was here neither should we.
How grateful are we  to have been so fortunate to not have circumstances that caused a spirit of homosexuality to have such an influence in us? Yet we all have some thorn in our side to keep us humble... Some people have more noticeable thorns out in the open for all to see and others have ones they can hide but EVERYONE has one.... Just because your a pot dont mean you can call the kettle black! or better yet MIKE I'm glad you werent so Heavenly Minded that you were No Earthly Good....

Thanks Donna & Sharon (blueskies)

Amen Panda (& Megan/WolfSpirit)...sort of similar to what Mary said. Many of us appear to be on the same wavelength!

Beth, I missed that blog (been too busy to keep up lately). I would appreciate a link, thanks! And I believe this issue is only gonna be thrust upon the church more in the future, as society increases pressure.

Crystal, yep...it very much is an issue of how we represent Christ!

Sis Cece....thank you, and I pray you/yours have a lovely weekend as well! =)

ps... Praise the Lord we who believe are not bound...we're free!!

Praising God for the comment under mine trom Tee Tow! The Lord is the one who created the universe. He can fix something as little, yes little, as bondage. The mountain may look huge to us and it may seem like it's a painful everyday fight but every day we live our lives as a sacrifice we have greater strength and the Holy Spirit has burned out more and more of what must go.

Just place it in the hands of Jesus. Don't worry about people. True Christians, especially if they see you placing all in Jesus and working to turn around will love the person and pray for them. Those who only say "Lord Lord" as a vain religious repition may hate but must answer for that sin in their own life. I pray for a spiritual movement of love from Christians.  I'll stay away from having homosexuals in membership in a church because thats is a hot topic but I believe they should be allowed to attend and we should be willing to help them. We must love them and shine the light because one of the main things Satan uses is the chuch when it comes to this stuff. 

Cathy, amen...God loved us in our sinful state, hopefully the Spirit in us will empower us to love others in their sinful state. Keeping in mind, of course, the Lord does not wish that we remain in our sinful state. Instead he gives us the Holy Spirit to convict us of sin and steer us toward obedience. (The Spirit can't convict if the Spirit isn't indwelling us, so it appears we must come to Christ first and then be changed.)

Stevie, regarding your questions.
Q#1 - If a gay person came to my house...
A - As a general rule, we do our best not to allow our house to be used to facilitate behavior of any kind that runs contrary to our understanding of God's word. Separate bedrooms for unmarried overnight guests involved romantically! I don't see how this relates at all to the blog, but you starred, so I answered. :)

Q#2 - When is sin not a sin, and will people be made accountable...
A - I'll answer your question with a question. When is a turtle not a turtle?! lol, you may have to elaborate, b/c I really don't know what you're getting at. I do know that God determines what is/isn't sin, not us. The bible lists quite a few things that displease the Lord, so they must be sins. The Holy Spirit convicts of sin. Paul says in Romans, "everything that does not come from faith is sin." I suppose ppl are accountable for falling short of God's lofty standard...which includes ALL of us. I guess I'll leave it there, pending your elaboration on your question. Blessings bro!

Grandma Brenda, preaching good news...what a privilege!! Thanks for the scriptures!

Sista DM, I appreciate your viewpoint. :)

Marcia (ihsallthetime), all I wrote about was treating a classmate with respect, dignity, and consideration, choosing to see him as an object of God's love (Christ died for him too).

If I pulled him just a little bit closer to Christ, I believe I did what I was called to do in his life. Had I driven himm away from Christ, I'm not so sure I would have served the cause of Christ in his life.

I don't believe love speaks the truth at ANY cost. Paul said love is patient and kind, never rude (1 Cor 13:4-5). To me this speaks of a gentle, respectful approach to "sinners", same as Jesus' approach in fact.

In my blog, I simply recalled a resentful man who was used to being treated a certain way by "Christians". The fact that I treated him differently took him off guard, and opened his mind a little. This was a good thing! My friend was used to Christians telling him the truth. The last thing he needed was me to tell him the dogmatic truth once more, like others before. He apparently needed a different approach, a respectful approach. That's the approach I appreciate when others have something to tell me. And again that appears to be the approach Jesus used.

clapping....

Just logged on...what a fun 4th of July!! Parade, fireworks, cookout, everything the holiday was supposed to be! And the weather was fabulous!!! Now to the responses...

Plumbline, thank you for the wisdom you shared. Your platoon is fortunate to have you!

Patty, often that verse says it all! Thanks for posting it. :-)

Preston, thanks so much bro! It is hard to take God's word in totality!! Things must be taken in context, including considering the audience. Apparent contradictions must be sorted out. Writer's intent considered. (and on and on) But there are quite a few passages that are very clear! And those we must never discount! (Often we're good at overlooking the verses that don't support the point we're trying to make at the moment, or the viewpoint we've decided to champion.) I simply try to be true to God's' heart to the best of my understanding!

Wow Jacqui, what an awesome example of love and perseverance...what a friend you were to Steve! Thanks so much for posting your story. You treated Steve w/love, and likely made a huge difference in his life. You certainly opened a window to the love of God w/your words and actions. God bless you!

Where does it say in the bible love the sinner and hate the sin.

What ever category sin falls under God hates it and if he hates it then we should hate it too. I know hate is a strong  but I hate to be called judgemental because I believe God's word when it comes to sin.It's sad when you try to tell the truth and you are called unloving and judgemental. Homosexuality is a false way to represent a God who made male and female for the purpose of being fruitful and multiply. Two men and two women can't do that. that's not hate that's love to tell the truth even if it get judgemental things thrown at you.I don't tell the truth because I want to hate but because I love.

Been a busy weekend! Will try to respond to these (lovely) comments. :-)

Lara, that's the thing. Many Christians say "Give em the Word!! Tell em it's sin!" But if that's all we got left for em, we can kiss em all goodbye cause they mostly been there done that. They don't even listen anymore. Rather than be the Christian clone (pull the string, always says the same predictable thing) I say we be human to em -- to everyone in fact. Form RELATIONSHIPS. That is why God gave us a heart isn't it? Thanks for your comment sister!

Pastor Elam, I agree God hates sin, we should too! Yes, it's sad when we share truth and are labeled unloving, haters, etc.  Basically I agree w/everything you wrote! Isn't it great that I could form a genuine bond w/my classmate, opening up lines of communication, even though theologically we come from opposite sides of the spectrum? Only love can do that, Pastor Elam, only love!

Ken, amen bro. Love is not compromise!

Craig, thanks, great scripture! (You have a knack for picking just the right scriptures most of the time!)

JustAGirl...thanks for reading and starring!!

higherground (Juanita), your stories all had this in common (among other things?), they were about valuing people and defying prejudice. You are so good at loving w/o prejudice!! You set a wonderful example! Thanks for posting!

Sheree - isn't it wonderful how you loved them w/o condoning the things the bible calls sin? That reveals to me the heart of God, who could die for people while they were still considered sinners! That's love...yet he never condoned or approved of sin!

I'm so delighted to read that, Juanita. (not about being right, but seeing that example of the POWER of a loving response....oh how much I hunger for that power in me!!)

Many thanks to you for posting that!  =)

HAHAHAA.... Stu, that's funny!!  (ok, I admit I had to bribe him, LOL)

Thanks Deb (ImaGrandma)!!

By this everyone will know that we are Jesus' disciples, if we love one another. Amen Emily. :)  (ps...I'm lookin up vailcalious!)

Leigh....you have no idea how much your comment blesses me. :)

Thanks Pastor Elam!

Emily...LOL! You made it up, and it means..... (wondering how it could mean anything if you made it up, haha)

Brian, "awesome juice"? LOL.. Well, I think the product of which you speak is "packaged" so to speak, and available to all. I'd call it the indwelling Holy Spirit, and this Spirit deserves ALL the credit for any "finer qualities" you or anyone else might see in me. I'm just glad he is so plainly visible at times. :-)  I'm glad you and I are in wholehearted agreement over what should be the Christian approach.

Branden, thanks for your comment. Agreement or (in this case) no, it is a pleasure to hear from you. I believe my friend of whom I wrote in the blog had already had plenty of Christians attempt to remove his rose colored glasses. I don't even think he had rose colored glasses about his lifestyle. I believe he compared his approach to other people with the approach used by so-called Christians, and found his approach to be far more authentic and loving. So his rejection of Christ was in large part a rejection of Christians, or at least the example they set in their words and actions towards "his kind" of people. I believe in loving first, and allowing the Holy Spirit to do the convicting. In my opinion (again), too few Christians have faith in the Holy Spirit to actually work inside us. I strove fruitlessly for years, until I actually stopped stifling the Spirit's work in my life. =)  

I posted this on a blog about healing but listening to it again...it is on how Jesus handled someone "untouchable" who felt shame and had  been ostracized...to risk it all   and in the song .....the woman with the issue of blood is wondering if he is going to rebuke her or shame her to the crowd.

this is bigger than stopping her issue..

homosexuality is an issue of the soul with an inner bleeding of the soul

notice as Nicole sings this, the dancer in the background with her wiggly flag thingy changes from red to white representing being made whole or being washed white as snow, i am guessing

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C7LyHDvcz3M&feature=related

My deepest apologies to the three members whose comments I just removed. (I partially restored one of them above.) It is nothing personal, I respect your opinions! I would just prefer that this blog remain on topic, and not deflect into the wider issue of whether or not homosexual behavior is scriptural. (IMO, scripture speaks for itself on that issue.)

Pastor Chuck  (Prentiss UM) - AMEN to your comment! Does Christ possess real power, or is he merely a namesake? I'm with you!!

GrammyB, your thoughts are appreciated!  Can ANY sin be adequately addressed w/o addressing the doorway? Your comment tips the hat to Pastor Chuck's words as well.

Dear Mike~
It appears to me:  You allow comments that are pro-homosexual fornication to remain on the site.  Why do You delete comments that are against this abomination?  The pro Sodomite comments are not on topic.
I do love You in the Lord, but, I must speak what is in my heart. {Bro-ken}

Thanks for the star(s) Bren!

Juanita, I so appreciate your comments.  Your heart for the Lord is clear to me. I certainly do agree that to love any sinner is NOT the same as condoning their sin. After 40+ yrs on this planet, I've learned through experience (backed up by scripture) that love definitely speaks more effectively than cold hard truth. That's not to say there is never a time for pure truth, but when it indicts it sure ain't very effective at building relationships....w/people OR w/God.

Thanks Preston, and yes, if he were still actively my friend, he would know what I believe. "HOW" we share the truth would make another wonderful blog. Unfortunately I did not know this man long enough to share w/ him in that way, basically all I had the opportunity to do was show Christ's love and acceptance of the person.

Good questions Gwen (gojolly)...lets see if I can squeeze in an answer. (Laura, can I pleez just type one more comment?)

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What sin did Christ die on the cross for?

He died for ALL sins.

Hell fire and damnation is reserved for the fallen angels and for those whose names are NOT written in the Book of Life.

The question is.... is the gay persons name in that Book.

According to Paul and the other apostles, we can tell who is a true follower and who is a fake or lukewarm believer. By their fruits. If a person is a believer, then the Spirit of Christ dwells within the person, and the person has a new heart, one which no longer seeks to do sin, because the new heart now seeks to please the Lord. Does the flesh get in the way? Of course, but that is why We are to crucify the flesh, and allow Christ to live through us.

 So if a gay person is truly saved, he will repent and seek the Lord's desires, which is found in the Word.

This is true for all sin, whether it be a little white lie, to a molester, or even the murderer.

Paul wrote to Corinth about the man in fortification and told them to deliver him to Satan, shutting him out of the fellowship, lest he pollute the rest of the believers. But when he repented, they were told to accept him back into the fellowship.

Amen Jess, amen Branden. We must ALL accept Christ as our Lord and Savior and repent of lifestyles lived in defiance of God's perfect will. BTW, you guys forgot to star my blog, hahaha!

Gary, I don't think it could have been said any better. Thanks for taking the time to lay it out.

Amen Margo--  your comments are always so well thought out.

Gil....stupendous comment!!! Hooray!!! (clapping)

"The focus of your post is not on the book chapter and verse with which we can confidently say you are familiar." 

Right on! To me, the bible is clear. But I'd like to move on from the fundamental issue of what scripture says, to how do we live it/share it! To my friend, who I'm SURE had heard before from other well meaning but overly zealous (and insensitive) Christians, I was a refreshing change. NOT b/c I compromised anything. But b/c I treated him with respect...like he deserved to be treated.Great comment Gil, you are quite perceptive.

John 8:7  If anyone of you is without sin, let him be the first to throw a stone.

We all have sinned, and always will, we will never be perfect.  We are suppose to show God's love to people so that way they might one day turn from their sin and turn to God, we have to just keep people in prayer, but we can't just say that we are christians, we have to also act it out, our actions will speak more than words.

Toni

Hi Toni! How's that new church?

You are very wise, sister. Faith w/o works is dead, yet God is patient with the stubborn sinner, not wanting any to perish. Lets love persistently!

Toni, we are to be the example of Christ's love. He loved the sinner, you, me, and even Mike n Laura's friend. Christ loved the dirty beggar with leprosy enough to touch him. He loved the sinner so much that He offered Himself as their (our) sacrifice. Nailing ALL sin to the cross. He wants us to be just as He is, as gentile as a lamb.

But we ARE to judge, but no the sinner living on the street with the needle in his arm, and HIV running through his veins. We are to hug and cry with the prostitute, to take the homeless sinner with alcohol and vomit on his shirt into our embrace.

We are to judge those in our fellowships that are a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolater, or a reviler, or a drunkard, or an extortioner, with these we are told not to even eat.

But those in the world (the sinner, murderer, fornicator, molester, drunkard, worshippers of false gods, wife beaters) , we MUST love, without condition!

Gary, I like your perspective. You almost make a good case for judging, too. Strike that, you DO make a good case. As long as we do that gently too (Gal 6:1).

We should copy Christ in all of His actions.

Even when judging. Even if we have to fashion a whip out of reeds. And kick the tables over. Or calling those as they are, whitewashed sepulchres.

Too often those in our fellowships, drive many of the world deeper into sin, because of their hypocrites. Hollering and yelling at the sinner for doing what they themselves do behind closed doors.

Our places of worship have become as the temple in Ezekiel's vision, (Ezek 9&10)

Sin runs rampant in our fellowships, and we turn a blind eye. Will He not condemn those that say nothing, just as much as those in the act. 

But we point our fingers at the sinner in the world, telling them to repent, to quit being homosexual, to quit cheating on their wives, to quit aborting the babies, while we say nothing about the evil sitting by our side singing vain and empty praises to a God that is ready to spew them from His mouth!

Do you know why the Lord loved David so much? It is because he knew the Lord's heart. He knew that no matter what he might slip into, if he truly repented, the Lord would forgive him of anything, but we forget that even though David cried before the Lord, there are always earthly re-actions to our actions.

Just as the man in fornication that Paul wrote about in the fellowship, when he was in sin, the fellowship shut him out, but when he turned away from his sin, after Satan had his way with him, he was welcomed back into the fold.

So too, when we see sin in the fellowship, we are REQUIRED to call it what it is, deliver the one over to Satan, and pray that he will turn and come back. But his blood will not be on our heads, whereas, if nothing is said, then the little evil will fester and pollute the whole fellowship.

We must love the one in the world, no matter what he maybe caught up in, because he does not know the forgivness of the Lord, we have to share His love.

But with that love He bestows upon us, there is a price to pay. And that price is often too high for many to pay. That price is our lives. Our desires. Our possessions, and even our families. Because when we became a follower of Christ, we crucified our wants, to allow Christ to live in us.

"i think the devil doesn't care what you do as long as it isn't displaying God's love."

Good one Juanita!

(and yes, I always deeply appreciate Gil's comments ... I always feel validated when he and I see eye to eye!)

Jude or Sarah, that sounds like a wonderful case where the Holy Spirit was active in ministry, and/or you came upon an exceptional case of a gay person whose life was touched by that particular style of presentation of the gospel. If numbers and societal attitudes are any indication, there might just be more effective means than approaching crowds with signs and crosses. But I'm genuinely glad to hear about the woman you encountered.

Just for the record, as I'm sure we all know, ALL sinners need to "forsake their rebellion and trust Jesus", not just gay ppl. And I also don't think anyone in this thread has advocated not trying to reach anyone for Christ. It does seem like there are many valid approaches (as Paul said,"I have become all things to all men, that I might by all means save some.") The common denominator is love...and we know what that looks like (1 Cor 13, Jesus' example, etc.).

Thanks for your comment!

Jude dude, I praise the Lord that the one lady came to the Lord, and a few of her friends. But would the good news be better to tell than the bad news.

The Lord placed a conscience in each of us, that already tells us when we are doing something that the Lord hates. So would it be better to tell the homosexuals as they were going to their film festival, that the Lord loves them and has already forgiven them of their sins, all they have to do is except and believe that the creator of heaven and earth came down in the flesh, suffered on the cross and died so that their sins would no longer be an issue.

According to the Word, the only thing that people will go to hell for is not having their names in the Book of life..... sin is no longer an issue, as it has ALL been forgiven. 

Once they accepted the good news, and repented of what they already know is wrong, the Holy Spirit will work in them about their life style and choices.

From what I see on the streets, there are already SO many people telling them what they are doing is wrong, but no one tells them of the Love Christ had for them. 

I just read an article posted on Cubbie's blog, that had some startling things to say. (Urging you to read it for yourself, too!)  The following excerpt vividly reminded me of my own experience, which I wrote about in THIS blog! From the article:

The panhandler touched Dave’s heart with his honest appeal. “I just want a burger.” Throughout the meal, Dave talked with him, finding out about his life and views. He didn’t try to cram the gospel in or argue. Dave later overheard the man say to his homeless companion, “Hey that guy’s a Christian and we actually had a conversation.” Dave wondered what kind of negative interactions with Christians from the past prompted that response! 

The author goes on to say-  If we lose our audience due to heartlessness it won’t matter how much truth we proclaim.

And.... One of the most important ministries you can have these days is to tear down negative stereotypes of Christ-followers simply by being Christlike. That may set the stage for tearing down myths and lies about God, the Bible, and Christianity.

I must say, I agree w/the points in the article Cubbie posted!

Thanks again, J&S.  Thankfully, Jonah was a very unique man in history with a very specific calling, who used a very specific approach. I'm thankful that his approach isn't a calling which every Christian is given... boy, what a mess the church would be in if every Christian stood on a street corner shouting "Repent or this city will be destroyed!" Jesus clearly demonstrated a different approach by showing love in a personal way, which had the same goal, to draw sinners into repentance.

BTW, did you notice the link to this article ? It's interesting!

Mat 10:27 What I tell you in the dark, speak in the daylight; what is whispered in your ear, proclaim from the roofs.

Let us keep in mind the point of this, which is that we should "not be afraid of them", words spoken before and after the verse above (vv 26 & 28). v.27 isn't necessarily to be taken literally, that is, unless we are literally spoken to audibly by Jesus in the dark, or audibly hear him whispering in our ear. :-)

Mark 6:12 They went out and preached that people should repent.

Yep, Jesus told em to go out and preach. Should we take these as our marching orders too? Well, I'd say yes IF ALL of us should also obey v.13 that immediately follows: They drove out many demons and anointed many sick people with oil and healed them. Have you also gone out and healed sick and driven out demons?

Luke 3:3 He went into all the country around the Jordan, preaching a baptism of repentance for the forgiveness of sins.

The "he" of course is John the Baptist, another unique man with a specific calling.

Rom 10:14 How, then, can they call on the one they have not believed in? And how can they believe in the one of whom they have not heard? And how can they hear without someone preaching to them?

I wouldn't say that I would never preach to someone, but notice that this verse doesn't say WHO should be preaching, or when. (same w/1 Cor 1:21 and 1 Pet 4:6) I usually attempt to bring friends to church to hear "preaching".

Phil 1:15-18  . 15It is true that some preach Christ out of envy and rivalry, but others out of goodwill. 16The latter do so in love, knowing that I am put here for the defense of the gospel. 17The former preach Christ out of selfish ambition, not sincerely, supposing that they can stir up trouble for me while I am in chains.[c] 18But what does it matter? The important thing is that in every way, whether from false motives or true, Christ is preached. And because of this I rejoice.

Though this scripture lauds preaching, it doesn't indicate that all believers should do it, or that it's the only way. 

2 Tim 4:2  Preach the Word; be prepared in season and out of season; correct, rebuke and encourage—with great patience and careful instruction.

Ah, good verse! I've discussed the topic of preaching, correcting, and rebuking w/others before. Folks often cite this verse to show that we should be quick to rebuke each other! But the reason I disagree is b/c Paul was specifically instructing Timothy, a pastor. The letter Paul sent to Timothy was a personal letter, NOT a letter to a church (to be read to entire churches). So if we take this scripture in it's proper context, I don't think we find an admonition for every believer to preach, correct, rebuke and encourage....although the admonition to encourage is certainly a good one, and found in the first letter to the Thessalonian church as well. So THAT is an admonition to all of us! (And therefore, Jude and Sarah, I thank you for your thoughtful comments and pray you stay in the word! You are a good student! (as I too hope to be!)  :-D

Now I would reiterate, Paul gives believers (and himself) freedom to use whatever methods they/he find appropriate for a given audience and a given culture. Read Paul's letter to the Romans, a church made up largely of Jews and those evangelized by Jewish Christians. The book of Romans has a full discussion of the Law. (The "law" is mentioned 30x in just the first 5 chapters!) The believers in this church would understand Paul's points very well. But interestingly, by contrast, Paul only mentioned the "law" 2x in all of the books of Philippians, Colossians, and Thessalonians combined! And for good reason, they would not have known what he was talking about!!

This is why Paul says  "I have become all things to all men, that I might by all means save some." Paul was a flexible man!! He was a wise man! He didn't waste his time using an evangelistic approach w/one group of ppl that he knew would be ineffective. 

Speaking of preaching, I know you prob feel like I've just preached to you, J&S! lol .. Sorry, but I've been over this ground a few times before. I love that you took the time to comment, and welcome more. THIS is what this blog was about! :-) God bless!

ps...Sorry about the length of the comment!

The fact that there are more than one method of evangelism is, I think, not at all in question here. The issue here is, what are acceptable, profitable, God ordained callings with regard to evangelising the lost.

Wether you are preaching from a street corner/rooftop/soapbox, witnessing one on one, or giving someone a gospel tract, we MUST warn the wicked. We must tell people there need for a savior and that means telling them that they are guilty before God because of their sin. I am sure that I will be told to make sure that I am preaching out of love. To that I would ask: What other motivation can there possibly be that is worth the risk of ridicule, pursacution, injury and even death?

We will be hated for Christ's sake. People simply don't like when you tell them that what they are doing is wrong. The reactions of this world should not govern how we witness, but rather odediance to God and his word should be or guide.

Eze 3:18,19
When I say unto the wicked, Thou shalt surely die; and thou givest him not warning, nor speakest to warn the wicked from his wicked way, to save his life; the same wicked man shall die in his iniquity; but his blood will I require at thine hand. Yet if thou warn the wicked, and he turn not from his wickedness, nor from his wicked way, he shall die in his iniquity; but thou hast delivered thy soul.
(I uderstand that this is a command specific to Ezekeil, but I believe it is profitable 2 Tim 3:16)

Hi J&S! I'll return later when I have more time, but wanted to post this scripture as well, not to discount preaching, but to reinforce what I previously wrote:

And His gifts were [varied; He Himself appointed and gave men to us] some to be apostles (special messengers), some prophets (inspired preachers and expounders), some evangelists (preachers of the Gospel, traveling missionaries), some pastors (shepherds of His flock) and teachers.  (Ephesians 4:11, Amplified)

If you are called, go! :-D  Those who are gifted and called, the Lord will certainly bless. I pray your discernment is accurate and your efforts are fruitful.

Later I hope to respond to the statement "The reactions of this world..." That comment interested me. :-)  God bless!

My point with that statment is that Christ tells us that we will be hated for his sake. People don't like the gospel because they don't want to turn from their sin. If we already know that we will be hated by some, we shouldn't let those negitive "reactions" stop us from proclaiming the truth and that is that God commands all men everywhere to repent.

To that I would say, let them hate us for who we are in Christ, not how we present Christ. Jesus said, "Blessed are you when people insult you, persecute you and falsely say all kinds of evil against you because of me."

If we are generally perceived as insensitive and rude, chances are, their criticism and insults are not false but accurately based on how we treated them. But if we are gentle and above reproach, their insults are more likely to be false, based purely on the content of our presentation rather than the style. Just b/c we have the truth doesn't give us a free pass to be abusive and call it love. NOT saying you're advocating that at all, J&S....Frankly, I'm confident that your approach is a loving one. I'm just communicating my concern with blanket statements, which we all occasionally make when we assume others know what we mean when they really don't. :-)

Branden, my beliefs are in line w/traditional or conservative Christianity in this area. I consider myself an inerrantist, so for the most part I would agree that "the plain meaning is the main meaning" when it comes to scripture. In my mind, to ask "is it or isn't it a sin" is a pointless question and a distraction from the more meaningful dialogue that can, and should, take place here.  :-)

Deb, I look forward to reading it, as I do all your blogs!

Pray the Lord will send the Holy Spirit before you, to break the calluses off his/her heart, then let him/her know that the Lord has already forgiven their sins when He suffered on the cross, ALL of them. No matter how horrendous, or evil it could be.

If he/she is open to the Holy Spirit, then explain that all he/she has to do is admit to the Lord that what he/she has been doing is wrong in the eyes of the Lord, 

If he/she is still open, assure them that He loves them, and will repent (to think differently or afterwards, that is, reconsider (morally to feel compunction): - repent.) and accept the Lord as their master, submitting to all that He requests of them.

Beating someone over the head with scriptures is not the way to will the lost, it is always pure love that melts the calluses from the heart.

Let the Holy Spirit move upon them to change their lives, I remember when I was saved, it was not an over-night change, but a gradual change, I was judged by some, trying to re-save me, telling me I was not saved, because I had sin in my life. Trying to explain to them was like talking to a brick wall. They expected me to be at their level over night.

Now I understand that it is not the sin the Lord sees, it is the heart, the intent.

Sin is no longer the issue, it is only whether their names are written in the Book of Life.

My sins have been cleaned, forgotten, but the guilt from continuing in my sin will drive a wedge between the Lord and I, causing me to lose faith, and eventually removing myself from the Book of Life through un-belief. That is why Christ said to go and sin no more, because He knows that if I continue, I will no longer server Him, but will serve my flesh.

Gary, I see love and relationship building as the answer to evangelizing sinners too. I believe almost every person in the gay community knows what "religious people" think of their lifestyle. Aren't they in for a surprise when they discover that Christ is interested in their hearts more than their behavior! I agree, sin isn't the issue.

One of the most powerful and well funded Homosexual Fornicator Sodomite Organizations is the 'Man/Boy Love'  Organization of North America.  (USA).  I am wondering if we should tell them that it's not their behavior, or, sin, that we, The Body of Christ Jesus are concerned about.  I don't want to appear harsh, or, unloving to anyone.

Sin is no longer the issue, what is, is whether your name is in the Book of Life.

Whether a person is gay, tells a white lie, steals by cheating on income tax, or any other sin,it is all sin. But when Christ died on the cross, He forgave all sin.

Letting the Holy Spirit work His work, will bring about repentance, no matter how hard I beat you with scriptures, until the Holy Spirit convicts you that what you are doing is wrong, whether being in a homo-sexual relationship, or telling white lies, cheating on income tax, or even getting mad at the Government, it is all sin.

So according to the Gospel of Ken, being a homo-sexual is worse that being a bigot, a hater of men, a thief, wife beater, adulterer, or even a liar?

I personally know of someone who may be, or, is a member of NAMBLA (North American Man/Boy Love Association).  Apparently he is associated with the  Roman Catholic Church. I want to Minister to him, and I believe he strongly ascribes to NAMBLA'S Creed that states:  "NAMBLA'S goal is to end the oppression of men and boys who have mutually consensual (sexual) relationships."  I truly do not want to appear judgmenta/ hatefull to this person.  I believe him to be a proffessing Christian. I know love is the greatest of all.

Then love him as Christ would, and does. Let the Holy Spirit move and work in him.

 Statements like "One of the most powerful and well funded Homosexual Fornicator Sodomite Organizations" show how much distain you have for the homo-sexual community, and they will never hear the love of Christ. Instead all they see and hear is another one of those hateful judgmental Christians.

Maddie, in all of my almost 30 years of being a Christian...I've moved around, been to more than a couple of churches, read ALL manner of Christian literature that included the topic homosexuality, etc...I have NEVER heard a Christian say that God hates homosexuals...NEVER, NEVER, NEVER...
The only place I've heard this is from people that are practicing homosexuality accusing other Christians of saying that...
I bet I could ask every Christian I come across this week (matter a fact, I think I'll do just that and report back with the results if Mike doesn't mind...and encourage all reading this to do the same...) if God hates homosexuals, and the answer would be an emphatic NO!!!

It is not always what is said Debbie, but what the actions are towards homo-sexual, and others in the world, whether they be Muslim, homo-sexual, cheaters, or any other kind of sinner, that is not hiding behind the church walls, claiming they are sinless.

How many of us will go into the prostitutes homes to eat a meal, just to visit.

How many will go to the homeless drunk and visit with them on the street, just to talk?

Not beat them over the head with scriptures about how much of a sinner they are.

Gary, I believe Jesus did just those things. He was drawn to humans who had reached the end of themselves. Isn't that what being broken before God is all about?

Debbie, thanks. That is an encouragement, I believe it's true! 

Ken, I read your blog, and I apologize for typing before praying and seeking the Lord about your comment.

Brandon, yes He wants us to turn from sin, because it draws us away from His love. He never pushes us away, but our guilt and conscious beat us down until we turn from Him.

Branden, some good discussion points. The best way to help someone out of their sin is to tell em what God's done for you. Has he helped you life a different life? Do you wake up every day and immediately drop to your knees in gratitude for the gift of life, and the blessing of a new day? Do you find God's word to be your bread of life, giving you a deep satisfaction that outlasts every imaginable trial? Do you continually thank God for his salvation and joys of the Holy Spirit in your life? Do you thirst for a better understanding of your spiritual inheritance as an adopted son of God? I could go on and on! To me, helping anyone caught in bondage to sin is more than getting them to stop sinning. To me it means helping them start living!

Where did Christ go regularly? Did He not eat with the sinners of the world? In fact, if memory serves correctly, it was a prostitute that washed His feet.

I believe proverbs was talking about going to the prostitutes house to "know" her.

Here is a good write up about Nicolaitans.

http://www.a-voice.org/library/nicolait.htm

To go alone...never... Jesus even sent the disciples out 2 by 2.... We have to be above reproach.

Mike n Laura, so true, let them know how much the Lord has forgiven us is such a strong witness.  Instead of pointing fingers at their sin, we point to Christ and His love for them.

Their conscious already knows they are living wrong, why throw it in their face.

I wrote a rhetorical blog about this too.

http://www.mychurch.org/blog/457547/Spiritually-torn-on-an-issue

hahaha...long lost valued friend. :-)  Glenn, you really pump me up with your comments, even if they be few and far between. Yep, one would need multiple sittings to go through all these comments. But aren't they great? Even the ones that don't agree w/me, are generally very Christlike, and even well spoken. Sometimes (or even often) I really love this place! :-)

God bless you Glenn, thanks for poppin in! 

Maddie M, wow, somehow I completely missed your comment. (pls forgive me!!)  I'm really glad you posted! I'm also glad I haven't seen any hateful comments yet on this blog, not even the ones I deleted. (They were only removed b/c I was afraid of getting off topic.) I pray you will continue to grow in your knowledge of our Savior!

I think it's all about how we witness. When Jesus went to the woman at the well, He was wise as to how he witnessed. He has a conversation with her first. We have to have conversations with people first before we can win their trust...thus, leading them to trust God. Think about us. When we are going through, we don't want to hear this first, "Child, don't feel that way. Child stop sinning." Nope! We want someone to show us they understand what we are facing. Then we are more opened to hearing "GO YOUR WAY AND SIN NO MORE!"

 9The Samaritan woman said to him, "You are a Jew and I am a Samaritan woman. How can you ask me for a drink?" (For Jews do not associate with Samaritans.[a])

 10Jesus answered her, "If you knew the gift of God and who it is that asks you for a drink, you would have asked him and he would have given you living water."

 11"Sir," the woman said, "you have nothing to draw with and the well is deep. Where can you get this living water? 12Are you greater than our father Jacob, who gave us the well and drank from it himself, as did also his sons and his flocks and herds?"

 13Jesus answered, "Everyone who drinks this water will be thirsty again, 14but whoever drinks the water I give him will never thirst. Indeed, the water I give him will become in him a spring of water welling up to eternal life."

 15The woman said to him, "Sir, give me this water so that I won't get thirsty and have to keep coming here to draw water."

 16He told her, "Go, call your husband and come back."

 17"I have no husband," she replied.

   Jesus said to her, "You are right when you say you have no husband. 18The fact is, you have had five husbands, and the man you now have is not your husband. What you have just said is quite true."

 19"Sir," the woman said, "I can see that you are a prophet. 20Our fathers worshiped on this mountain, but you Jews claim that the place where we must worship is in Jerusalem."

 21Jesus declared, "Believe me, woman, a time is coming when you will worship the Father neither on this mountain nor in Jerusalem. 22You Samaritans worship what you do not know; we worship what we do know, for salvation is from the Jews. 23Yet a time is coming and has now come when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth, for they are the kind of worshipers the Father seeks. 24God is spirit, and his worshipers must worship in spirit and in truth."

 25The woman said, "I know that Messiah" (called Christ) "is coming. When he comes, he will explain everything to us."

 26Then Jesus declared, "I who speak to you am he."

 28Then, leaving her water jar, the woman went back to the town and said to the people, 29"Come, see a man who told me everything I ever did. Could this be the Christ[b]?" 30They came out of the town and made their way toward him.

Rhett, thanks for your comment, buddy. Love him! My brother was like that kid. My brother was NOT homosexual, but the harsh treatment he got drove him AWAY from the cross of Christ. Interestingly it wasn't the truth, it was the so-called Christians, that seemed to push him away from God.

Destiny, good points, I agree wholeheartedly. 

Marcia, I appreciate your zealous thirst for righteousness sister.