Pastor Tim
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||September 04, 2007 at 5:36am|email it|1168 reads
 

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Mike n Laura
September 04, 2007 at 5:59am
Tim,
The article was too long for me to read yet in its entirety, but I'm starring now based on the 26 questions at the end. Excellent! I plan to use them at our next men's accountability breakfast in 2 weeks. Thanks for another excellent post!  ~mike
Danny Rojas
September 04, 2007 at 6:50am

Hey, Tim,
Another great article! In our day of megachurches and consumer driven worship, where people can pick and choose what church they like and get lost in the masses, it's easy to forget that the Great Commission is a call to make disciples, not just "reach people." God bless us and help us become what we were called to be.

MaKelly
September 04, 2007 at 7:20am

Pastor Tim this is a great message I took this class when I was in Freeport NY at wolm, and it does make a difference
1. your a servant for life - Exodus 21:2-6
2.Characteristics of a Holy Life Psalms 15:1-5
3.Standing in the gap Ezekiel 22:30
4.sincers search for God jeremiah 29:10-14
5, key to walking with God Pslams 18:25 -26
6..those who obey the Lord Joel 2:11
7. Follow Jesus Matthew 9:9
8.Counting cost Matthew 8:19-20
 Because my life is like living in a fish bowel and all the world is watching, and you are right I am to walk and talk like Jesus because I am a christain representing Jesus. God also knows He is the only perfect one so I'm going to press on to strive for profection. The book
“In Rebuilding Your Broken World, Gordon MacDonald, yes I do have to work on a few things on that list, but I must say I know my world in christ Kingdom of God that lives in me & personal is not broken thanks to my God.
Pastor Tim is there anyone that you know that can say they do everything on that list?    PHILIPPIANS 3

14 I press toward the mark for the prize of the high calling of God in Christ Jesus.

COST OF DISCIPLESHIP, THE
Dietrich Bonhoeffer (1937)

Dietrich Bonhoeffer had smart genes. His father was the foremost neurologist and psychiatrist teaching at the University of Berlin; his mother was the granddaughter of a noted church historian. Dietrich began theological studies as a teenager and qualified to teach at the University of Berlin at age 24.
In his early writings, Bonhoeffer said God was found in the Word and realized in real-life situations. He asserted that Christ lived in the community of believers. These assumptions underlie his later works as well.
While studying at Union Theological Seminary in New York City (1930-1931), Bonhoeffer team-taught a Sunday school class at a church in Harlem. He learned as much as he taught. This experience proved to be a powerful lesson on how people could endure dehumanizing oppression by exercising simple, biblical faith, particularly in praise and worship. Bonhoeffer later returned to Germany, where Adolf Hitler was gathering power.
While many pastors yielded to Hitler’s interference in church affairs, Bonhoeffer resisted and helped create the Confessing Church in Germany. In 1935 he began and led an illegal seminary in Finkenwalde. He also identified himself with the resistance movement against Hitler.
Published in 1937, The Cost of Discipleship established Dietrich Bonhoeffer as a theologian of high distinction. With this work, Bonhoeffer reaffirms the concept of faith in the Christian life, emphasizing the Word (the Scriptures); the sacraments (baptism and the Lord’s Supper); and the earthly community of faith (the church). The book’s title in German is simply Discipleship, since Bonhoeffer takes faith, justification, and sanctification (the pillars of reformed theology) and unites them into the single concept of following Christ.
The key formula of his work is “only he who believes is obedient, and only he who is obedient believes.” Bonhoeffer claims that this theorem revalidates the complete premise of justification and restores its true value. But Bonhoeffer was always inclined to emphasize the community of faith as well. In The Cost of Discipleship Bonhoeffer insists that “it is impossible to become a new man as a solitary individual. . . . It means the church, the body of Christ, in fact it means Christ himself.” This does not mean, however, that discipleship should become a world movement or creed; nor is discipleship an ideology or technique, since these require measurable results. To Bonhoeffer, right Christology requires a person to be called and to follow. Those who do this “are ready to suffer with the Word.”
The book is divided into four chapters. The first one challenges the reader with a discourse on grace and discipleship. Bonhoeffer attacks the “cheap grace” that was being preached in the churches of his time; he counters this easy-believism by asserting, “When Christ calls a man, he bids him come and die.” Chapter 2 further develops Bonhoeffer’s discussion of discipleship as it examines Jesus Christ’s demands on the believer in the Sermon on the Mount. Chapter 3 discusses spreading this message of Jesus Christ, and chapter 4 addresses the believer’s relationship to the church, the body of Christ on earth.
In this classic work, Bonhoeffer describes a disciple’s life as simple and carefree. This simplicity is rooted in the disciple’s obedience to one master, which sets the disciple free from other concerns. The truth of this work is reinforced by the real-life example of Bonhoeffer himself.
Watching the Nazis’ growing violence against Jews and others, Bonhoeffer plotted with others to kill Hitler. An attempt failed, and Bonhoeffer was arrested. He was hanged in 1944.
Few authors have lived out their writings to such an extent. Bonhoeffer expressed what he believed in print, and then he acted on those beliefs.

shane
September 04, 2007 at 7:42am
I enjoyed and agree with everything in your blog except for the example you used at the beginning dealing with evolution and Christianity.  I don't see a passion for discipleship excluding the scientific explanation adopted by this professor.  It seems to me he is finding where the scientific experts can be placed in Christianities history.  I believe one of the main qualities of discipleship is the ability to look at every issue objectively not subjectively.  If what we have always thought isn't true, that doesn't make us less of a disciplined disciple of Christ.  The closer I get to Christ the more I desire what he desires.  He would desire to question everything and be shocked at nothing.  Truth is truth no matter what we believe and a modification to our thinking may be necessary now and then, not because we are not discipleship oriented but because we are.

Shane  
Pastor Tim
September 04, 2007 at 8:02am
Shane,

Thank you for your response. I undertsand that the issue of origins is very much a debatable issue within Evangelical circles. My concern with the professors response was that a naturaistic interpretation of science was superior to the Bible when establishing his version of the creation story.

With that said, you have given me an idea for my next blog. Which version of the creation story do we believe?

1. Creation
2. Divine Design
3. Theistic Evolution
4. Evolution

Thanks again Shane for your response!
Pastor Tim
September 04, 2007 at 8:08am
MaKelly, Danny, Mike, Thank you for your responses.

MaKelly, I loved the Bonhoeffer quote that you gave that says, "only he who believes is obedient, and only he who is obedient believes.”

Danny, you are exactly right when you said that the Great Commission is a call to make disciples, not just "reach people."

Mike, those questions should be great for your accountability breakfast!
Deb
September 04, 2007 at 9:36am
Pastor Tim, this is a well written and well thought out blog.  I do appreciate the questions towards the end.  They are good questions to gauge where we are in our walk with God.  I plan to keep them handy.
Reverend Floyd
September 04, 2007 at 9:53am
Grin.... I Liked it enough to Post a URL Link on My Yahoo 360 Blog...

http://blog.360.yahoo.com/blog-EX4i.hslabP2yeEEYtzHvOO6

 Keep Searching , Asking , Praying and Getting...
 God Bless You and Yours... Brother Tim ! 
Eddie
September 04, 2007 at 9:56am
Very well said yet again Pastor Tim.
Pastor Tim
September 04, 2007 at 11:30am
Deb, Reverend Floyd, Eddie thank you for your kind words.

Rev. Floyd I am honored to have my post on your blog.
hopefienddave
September 04, 2007 at 12:41pm
I might add that while we count the cost of following Christ. We might want to count the cost of following the enemy.  Jails Institutions, Death and Hopelessness.  The truth of the matter the cost of following Christ is high but it's stated up front and Christ already paid the bulk of it.
Connie Radomski
September 04, 2007 at 4:49pm

I am so pleased that I took the time to read your blog today...every last word including the bibliography... Pastor Tim.

I was still chewing on the Technology in the Church blog (and I must say it changed my life, and led me to Pastor Ken and Arminata, who are experts in the art of e-videoing and podcasting and are willing to share their know-how with...US!!!!!!!!  I sent the article and comments to the prime movers and shakers at my church in Largo, Florida as well...WHAT A GREAT DISCUSSION (part I and II)! 

So I wasn't "ready" for this one on discipleship, but it happened to be what my pastor is speaking on all month.  This gives me a "leg up" on the horse.  I must confess, I've been a Christian in church for 50 years and yet I've never heard it explained so clearly and so succinctly!  If everyone only had this one page, and did what it suggests, it could turn America upside down and spread to the rest of the world. 

I'm already getting ready with increased enthusiasm and energy to podcast to India and other places as "Gospel Mother Goose"...(technological child evangelism) as a direct result of your last blog.  I told my pastor with results like Pastor Ken and Arminata have been having, there is no time to waste in getting the live-wire Christians at our church to share on the internet! They went from 20 people wanting to hear to 4000 in 8 months! What an opportunity! How can we sit still?!

My homeschooled daughter and I will ask each other the 26 questions each week and see what happens. God definitely had a plan in letting me "stumble upon" MyChurch.com through Paul Mason (whom I call the Christian Shakespeare of Prayer). You and he are such blessings...may I encourage you to send your blogs and comments as podcasts or evideos to the seminary in Bangalore to edify the pastors in training there (it would help them with learning English to hear them since I bet their English isn't all that good, maybe someone could translate the transcripts!)...and I'm hoping to send computers and camcorders to them in the near future (Lord supplying) to enable them to communicate with their countrymen.  Perhaps Christianity will enter the Moslem world this way.  I'm going to suggest to the Independent Mission Board that we ask each country to flood India with gifts of computers. Then they won't be able to resist. I hope many muslims who haven't caved in to the Taliban (which thinks pictures are evil) will use the computers and find the podcasts.

Connie Radomski, First Baptist Church of Indian Rocks member,

also a Burning Bush Prayer Group member

Mike n Laura
September 05, 2007 at 10:47am
And we, who with unveiled faces all reflect the Lord's glory, are being transformed into his likeness with ever-increasing glory, which comes from the Lord, who is the Spirit. (2Cor3:18)   ...sorry folks, this popped into my head as I read the above comment. God bless you Sam
Valerie Williams
September 05, 2007 at 12:58pm

1. How is your relationship with God right now? Prayerfull
2. What have you read in the Bible in the past week? Genisis, Exodus, Leciticus, John, Matthew, Jude and some Psalms
3. What has God said to you in this reading? In the beginning ... and the evening and the morning was the first day.... and the evening and the morning were the second day  (day beginns in the evening.)  Passover is at least 8 days long and has two sabbats.  one of these (the second) was the day after Jesus was in tombed was that sabath a Friday evening? or a Thursday evening?
4. Where do you find yourself resisting Him these days?
In everything I can't walk or breath with out him throught the holy Ghost I am able to carry on.
5. What specific things are you praying for in regard to yourself?
A closer walk with Jesus and more respect for my finances I.E. better stuartship.
7. What are the specific tasks facing you right now that you consider incomplete?
 The great commision who? have I brought to Christ?  Has any one changed have I truley made all the changes I need to make? 
8. What habits intimidate you?

9. What have you read in the secular press this week?
Homelessness and section eight in California LACounty are we working on geting back or credibillity our ranking our ability to help others we had lost our standing with the government  what is being done?  found no answers. only more questions.
10. What general reading are you doing? Egypt.  the toms of the kings, the dead sea scrools the lost books of the bible, Billy D Williams "S life story forgot the name of that one, Sidney Poiter's The Measure of a man, Andrew M Greeley this years 4 books have read all previous years already, The Torah, The Tanuka.
11. What have you done to play?
tetrus on my phone
12. How are you doing with your spouse? Kids?
 phone and e-mail them
13. If I were to ask your spouse about your state of mind, state of spirit, state of energy level, what would the response be? NA
14. Are you sensing spiritual attacks from the enemy right now? No yesterday when I could not walk and had to pay rent yes today no though I need at least $100.00 to replace funds I should not have used to feed church members going to a fellowship meeting where they had food after.
15. If Satan were to try to invalidate you as a person or as a servant of the Lord, how might he do it? He is al way trying but Now I think I usually detect him and stop him in his tracks.
16. What is the state of your sexual perspective? fairly leavel Tempted? fighting temptation Dealing with fantasies? praying agenst them Entertainment? No
17. Where are you financially right now? (things under control?mostly under anxiety?somewhat but trying to leave it at the alter it is hard when on a limited income an can't work without ending up in the hospital  in great debt?about $100.00 out of control)
18. Are there any unresolved conflicts in your circle of relationships right now?
Not that I am aware of.
19. When was the last time you spent time with a good friend of your own gender? None live near me so it has been a while though I have spent time with a few of the sisters in my church.  Praying and leting them know I care about them.  They probubly don't think of me as a friend. 
20. What kind of time have you spent with anyone who is a non-Christian this month?
I just baked cookies and distributed them to about a dozen homeless people.
21. What challenges do you think you're going to face in the coming week?  Meetings with my Adult Literacy Student (helping him deal with some of the problems that come up when you work and have everthing memorized because you can't read and the one who has read to you is now sick and can not read to him. Month more of that and finances how to make money I don't have and getting ready for Pastors anaversary? and the Church anaversary + + + + +.
22. What would you say are your fears at this present time?
23. Are you sleeping well? No
24. What three things are you most thankful for?  Salvation Kids Church
25. Do you like yourself at this point in your pilgrimage? Yes
26. What are your greatest confusions about your relationship with God?”NA


Pastor_Ken_and_Aminata
September 05, 2007 at 6:28pm
Pastor Tim,

Excellent post.   I love how God speaks to each of us and reveals Himself to us.  In our E-Telecast I spoke about the very things you wrote about.... "What Have You Done For Him lately" using Rom 12:1 "give your body as a living sacrifice...."

"Preparing For the Cross Walk"  Mark 8:34 " Jesus say, if any one would be followers of me, let him set aside his own self ambitions, shoulder his cross and follow me."

And beginning tomorrow... on the E-Telecast, "Following In the Footsteps of Christ"....   The Christian life ought to be one of sacrifical living... 


Pastor Aminata
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