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| God Didn't Write the Bible |
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. . . and that doesn’t hurt its holiness or its validity! When I was a child my Sunday School teachers used to say that God whispered the words of the Bible, and someone wrote them down. There is some level of comfort in this idea, and many Christians I love defend it passionately, but there are problems with this theory. Humans penned the words, humans copied the words by hand, and humans have translated it (and continue to translate it) into hundreds of languages over many centuries. All of these leave room for error. If God dictated the entire Bible word for word, then surely there would be no discrepancies; and those who defend His authorship will just as passionately defend the claim that no discrepancies exist. Herein lies the problem: There are numerous discrepancies.
I understand and respect the need for some to yell "heresy" about now! I speculate a twofold reason for this passion: 1) The human need for God to be tangible, thus the equating of the Bible with God Himself. (With our physical bodies we can’t touch, see, or hear God, but we can touch, see, and hear the Bible.) 2) The fear that if any discrepancy is found in the Bible that would mean God was not real or that the Bible was not Holy. Well, I hope to dispel both of these ideas here. The Bible does contain hundreds of minor discrepancies. Yet God is very real, and His Word is Holy.
The Bible is the inspired Word of God. It is the record of God's revelation of Himself to humanity. There is no question that God inspired it, as, for example, it contains prophecies that only God could know. There is, however, a crucial difference between spiritual revelation and human words. Have you ever tried to put a spiritual revelation into words? One does not fit perfectly into the other, but words are all we have with which to communicate. The words of the Bible were penned by writers who lived in close relationship to God, and were under some level of the Power of the Holy Spirit as they wrote (we do not know for sure who all the writers were), but nowhere do we read that they were immaculately conceived, or that they were transfigured as they wrote. They were not perfect or omniscient people. Many of them made judgments in their lives for which they would be arrested today, and maybe even given the death penalty. They included adulterers, murderers, a former persecutor of Christians, . . . Despite their humanness, however, the writings they left us are the most valuable and precious tangible gift from God to us. An amazing gift by which we can learn of the life and teachings of Jesus and of the beginnings of God’s relationship with His creation. An awe-inspiring set of writings that have revolutionized our world for many centuries. The all-time best-selling book worldwide. And I'm glad I don't have to imagine life without it.
Although most Christians have a Bible in their homes, only a small percentage of them ever read it from cover to cover. They claim its value (I’ve heard many say that if their house caught fire, their Bible would be the first thing they’d grab on the way out), but it has largely become an icon. They like to talk and read about what it says, but many Christians don’t pick up the actual Bible except to carry it under their arms when they go to church. Yet many of these same Christians are the most defensive of its perfection. Why? Because they have equated it with God. Many Christians, knowingly or unknowingly, worship the Bible. It has unknowingly become their idol, and the idea that the Bible might have a tiny error in it is as blasphemous to them as saying that God makes mistakes.
God does not make mistakes. God is omnipotent, omniscient, and omnipresent. God is not confined to or limited by our finite understanding of Him, and He is not confined to any writings, no matter how great and how inspired. Language is man’s means of communication. God does not confine Himself to written or spoken human language. Humans, on the other hand, even when given a spiritual truth or revelation, can only process it through our own finite mental and spiritual understanding. Thus our attempts to explain will never be equal to God's perfection. God inspired the writers of the Bible, but He did not author it.
A present day example of this distinction: I recently visited a church where the pastor preached an inspired sermon. He was passionate about living for God, and His relationship with God was not questionable. He claimed God gave him his sermon, and I believe him. Yet, perhaps due to his level of education, his sermon did have a couple of errors. Not because God doesn’t know everything, but because the pastor doesn’t. Still God is using him. Isn’t it amazing that God chooses to work through His imperfect children! (That includes us!)
The book we know as the Bible is actually not one book but a compilation of 66 different inspired writings, written in several different genres by many different authors over a span on many centuries. Some of these writings are personal letters. Others are books of poetry, or allegory, or law, or history, or prophecy . . ., each of which should, by nature of the genre, be read a little differently. The Biblical writers, just as writers today, wrote to and within the confines of the cultures of which they were a part.
I have heard many Christians proclaim emphatically that the Scripture needs no interpretation, that it speaks for itself. As humans, however, there is no such thing as reading anything (the newspaper, the Bible, this blog . . .) without applying our own interpretation to that reading. We all read through the eyes and ears of our own education and experience. Most of us developed our own interpretations from those of our spiritual leaders past and present (pastors, teachers, parents, spouse . . .), although we may be totally unaware of their influence. All of us interpret, but not always responsibly. A most complete interpretation of each individual book of the Bible involves several questions, like: Who wrote it?
When was it written?
For what purpose was it written?
To whom was it written? (Who was its intended audience?)
What genre is it?
What was the culture in which the author lived?
What did the words mean in their original language? (If you have ever mastered a second language, you know that translation is definitely not an exact science.)
How would the original readers have understood it? Can God speak to someone who doesn’t know any of this? Absolutely! And He does all the time! God’s Word is powerful, and He can use it to speak to anyone. Our spiritual teachers and leaders, however, should pay attention to these questions.
One of the most widespread errors in interpretation is thinking the Bible was written primarily as a rule book for our 21st century American lives. That’s such a small part of what the Bible is, comparable perhaps to the popular feel-good slogan that the Bible is "God’s love letter to us." (On one level, there is some truth to that, but those who have adopted this slogan I suspect have not read the first several books of the Old Testament lately, books filled with war, and plundering, and killing.) Certainly parts of it are applicable to teaching us how to live, but the Bible was not written primarily as a book of rules for life in the 21st century (or any century). None of the Biblical writers anticipated that their writings would be read, and basically worshipped, thousands of years later on the other side of the earth! They wrote for a specific audience and a specific purpose. If, however, we read it with intelligence and responsibility, its most profound truths are timeless, as is God, and these truths should be the structure upon which we build our Christian lives. The foundation, however, should be Christ alone. (See my blog The words or The Word?)
Today’s Christian culture has become extremely political and polarized within itself. Despite Jesus’ repeated emphasis on the unity of the believers, we seem to have an inate need to divide ourselves. Those who think just like I do vs. those who don’t. Of course those who don’t are the "bad guys." We have developed many a litmus test for weeding out those who do not fit our camp, including the words infallible and inerrant to describe the Bible. Now, I have personally found these words completely useless in any meaningful discussion, because every person I have ever heard use them has his own definition of exactly what they mean. In my experience these words are meant only to divide God’s children into factions, something Jesus prayed against in His final earthly prayer. He knew us even then, didn’t He! His prayer was that we would be one. If we are His children, we are all in the sheepfold, although no two of us will see things exactly the same.
Am I attempting to discredit the Bible or prove it invalid? NO!!! I revere, treasure, and cherish the Bible. I read and study it with diligence (see my blog on Bible Reading), and it molds and shapes my life. Yet I do not worship the Bible. I study the Word because it points me to the One Who alone is worthy of my worship, the Creator of the heavens and the earth, the Sustainer of all life, the Omnipotent, Omniscient, and Omnipresent God of Abraham, Moses, David, Peter, and Paul. The God of Mother Teresa and Billy Graham. God alone is perfect and worthy of worship.
In my opinion the many small discrepancies in the Bible serve to reinforce its validity, not detract from it. The fact that different writers tell different versions of the same story, with all the most important details in unison with each other, adds much more validity than if they all told it in the exact same words. Do any two witnesses have exactly the same interpretation of an event? (Think of a car accident for example. Everyone is caught up in the moment, seeing things from their own perspective, and should they 30 years later decide to write their memory of it, there would surely be discrepancies. Yet collectively they would preserve and validate the reality of the event.)
So, what if there were an error in the Bible? That’s an important question, because there is! Many, in fact! Some are probably copy errors made by the scribes. Others are translation errors. Others are just educated guesses from conflicting documents about which is closer to the original (which by the way we do not have any of). Others are products of the time of writing. For example, it was not known at the time of Biblical writing that the earth was round. Other discrepancies are due to different eye-witnesses perceiving events from different vantage points, or the time period between the actual event and the time it was written down. (Do we not all miss a detail or two when we tell about something we saw thirty years ago?) Most of the Biblical accounts were written long after the actual events, from memory or from years and years of oral tradition.
OK, I made the claim that there are hundreds of small discrepancies in the Bible. If you are still reading, you must be interesting in examining this. At some later date, should there be interest, perhaps I will compile such a list. For now, however, just to provide an example, I will call your attention to two discrepancies in one particular story. Please don’t take my word for it. Read it for yourself, and feel free to share your thoughts:
This story appears twice, once in 2 Samuel 24 and again in 1 Chronicles 21. David sends Joab and the commanders of the army to take a census of Israel and Judah. Two discrepancies between the two stories: 1) One version (2 Sam.) says The Lord incited David to take the census. The other (1 Chron.) says Satan incited him. 2) 2 Sam. numbers the men of Israel as 800,000 and the men of Judah as 500,000. 1 Chron. numbers the men of Israel as 1,100,000 and the men of Judah as 470,000. Some would try to explain these differences away. 2 different censuses perhaps? If you read both accounts in their entirety, it seems obvious they are the same census. I choose to accept that these details really make no difference. Either way, the important part of the story seems to be that David took a census. Nonetheless, it seems impossible that both these Biblical account can be inerrant.
What does the Bible claim for itself? Is there any claim of inerrancy or infallibility? Is there any claim that it should be worshipped? Is there any claim of being the ultimate authority for matters like history or science? If not, we do it and ourselves a disservice when we put such demands on it. The most quoted passage used to justify these claims is 2 Timothy 3:16, 3:16 All scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness,
but if we read it carefully we will see how much our own interpretation has been added to its words. Also it is worth noting that our current Biblical canon was not established until the fourth century (See Biblical Canon in Wikipedia), and that when the New Testament writers wrote of Scripture, they were referring to certain Old Testament scrolls, and probably some other writings that our canon has not preserved. That is to say that Paul, for example, did not refer to his writings as Scripture. With that in mind, following are a few verses that deal with Scripture, all of which prove it as the inspired Word of God, with no manmade claims necessary:
4:21 And he began to say to them, "Today this scripture has been fulfilled in your hearing."
24:27 And beginning with Moses and all the prophets, he interpreted to them in all the scriptures the things concerning himself.
5:39 You search the scriptures, because you think that in them you have eternal life; and it is they that bear witness to me; 5:40 yet you refuse to come to me that you may have life.
18:28 for he powerfully confuted the Jews in public, showing by the scriptures that the Christ was Jesus.
What is most amazing to me about the Bible is not that it is without any error, but that, despite its many authors, and the many generations and cultures that its writings span, the main message is so consistent and rich. God is sovereign. Jesus Christ is the Savior and Redeemer of the world. And the Holy Spirit is alive and well in the lives of His people, and in the reading of His Word.
Once we are able to give up the notion that there is no human element in the Bible, we are free to reap all the richness and depth that it possesses! I am infinitely grateful to God that He has preserved these writings throughout all generations that they may teach even us! Thanks be to God for the great and wonderful gift of His Word! Selah!
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Robin |
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October 19, 2007 at 5:53am |
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Kathy,
Some great thought provoking ideas. It basically comes down to one basic question to be answered:
Do I believe the Bible to be inspired by the One true God? Accept it by FAITH! |
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WOW! WOW! WOW! WOW! WOW! WOW!
AMEN SISTA CHICKADEE! AMEN! AMEN! AMEN!
BLESS YOU. BLESS YOU BLESS YOU
I will definatley stay tuned to this blog today.... you get today's *
Love you
Seven |
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Glenn |
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October 19, 2007 at 6:34am |
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Hey Kathy,
Well written explanation of God's inspired Word.
You wrote, "I read and study it with diligence (see my blog on Bible Reading), and it molds and shapes my life. Yet I do not worship the Bible. I study the Word because it points me to the One Who alone is worthy of my worship, the Creator of the heavens and the earth, the Sustainer of all life, the Omnipotent, Omniscient, and Omnipresent God of Abraham, Moses, David, Peter, and Paul. The God of Mother Teresa and Billy Graham. God alone is perfect and worthy of worship."
I can't agree more with you here. Studying the Bible is the only real way to understand God's love for each of us. We need to know His Word in our own lives, and what better place to learn of His Word than to read it and study it.
Thanks for your words on His Word!
peace |
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Kathy,
I don't know what to say... other than.. I love what you do... because what you do... how you write... you do it soooooo... very, very well. Excellent work.
Pastor Aminata |
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| Very thought provoking blog and well written. I agree with you that the WORD was inspired by our FATHER and that there are errors because humans wrote and translated it. The basic instructions, however are still in tact and I thank my FATHER for that. He has given us a foundation to worship, understand and love him. |
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Kathy |
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October 19, 2007 at 10:43am |
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Robin, Seven, Glenn, and mstovall, thank you for reading my blog and sharing your reactions! By Faith indeed, Robin!
Soldier (aka Susie/Susan/PreacherGirl/DiscipleofChrist/Angel/Lily), I deleted your comment for its extreme length, not its message. I invite you to condense your thoughts and repost should you so choose. Opposing viewpoints are respected. |
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Kathy |
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October 19, 2007 at 11:33am |
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| Pastor Aminata! I didn't mean to leave you out! I am always grateful to hear from you! Thank you! |
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Deb |
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October 19, 2007 at 12:28pm |
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| Excellent blog Kathy, and well written. Gives me a lot to think about! |
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First, as for "Soldier (aka Susie/Susan/PreacherGirl/DiscipleofChrist/Angel/Lily)," I thought multiple profiles were not allowed? This person sounds very argumentative. --hmmm.
"my Sunday School teachers used to say that God whispered the words of the Bible, and someone wrote them down."<grin> The 1 Timothy referenced word "inspired" is literally "God-breathed" in the Greek.
Kathy, I read your entire post and you have done a very good job of remaining "moderate" - but...
You are walking a tight rope. With one breath, you fall into a very liberal camp, and that's a hard line to maintain IMHO.... many on the right or conservative fundamentalist side (of which I am a part) would say that arguing the "inerrancy of scripture" strikes at the very foundation of Christianity. And I have a very hard time with your assertion that "God did not write the Bible." Yes, there are arguable "discrepencies", all by now have been found and have various explanations, some of which you mentioned.
My main problem with your post is that many that are less grounded can and do use your very assertion as a prybar to say that we as Christians are only following the "fables of men." (see below) Therefore the Bible is nothing more than another spiritual guide placed only a little higher than other self-help bestsellers. You are not saying this as far as I can tell! But your very provocative title does IMHO.
1:16 For we have not followed cunningly devised fables, when we made known unto you the power and coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, but were eyewitnesses of his majesty. 1:17 For he received from God the Father honour and glory, when there came such a voice to him from the excellent glory, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased. 1:18 And this voice which came from heaven we heard, when we were with him in the holy mount. 1:19 We have also a more sure word of prophecy; whereunto ye do well that ye take heed, as unto a light that shineth in a dark place, until the day dawn, and the day star arise in your hearts: 1:20 Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation. 1:21 For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake [as they were] moved by the Holy Ghost.
I say this all with love, Kathy... and hope that it is taken as such <grin>
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You mention the book but not the verce. I don't believe there is anywhere that one million in the Bible. They did not have a count of that high. That is why they said things like,"thousands of thousands", etc. I do know that one could have been a count of the male population. the othere could have been the "men" no gender intended. Meaning all of Isrel. I also could not find the word "incited" in my Strong's. Census also does not appear. Number, yes, but no census.
I can not understand anyone worshiping God and leaveing the Word, writen or otherwise as none worshiping! |
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That is spot on about worshiping the Bible, Kathy. I spent a few years of my life arguing about Biblical facts, instead of pursuing the character qualities of the God behind the Bible. When I was arguing, I couldn't get people to listen. As I'm showing God's character to people, I seem to be able to say anything about Him. What was I thinking? The Bible doesn't say that arguing with anyone will save anybody. And knowing the Bible backwards and forwards doesn't necessarily indicate spiritual maturity. I think we should study the Bible as much as possible, but we should study it with a mind towards applying it to ourselves, and understanding the God behind it. The Pharisees studied God's Word for a living, but they didn't recognize God in front of their faces. |
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Great thought Kathy,
These we're some of the reasons for various responses I've made over the last year on scripture and it's interpretation. To repeat a few comments.
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Sorry,
I'm not sure why my incomplete thought wouldn't delete....
Here you go again,
I find some believers have mistakenly created a false trininty of Father, Son, and Holy Scripture. In doing so relegating the Holy Spirit to some dispensational closet where He has no person or essence.
For most of it's history the church has used St. Vincent of Lerin's "rule" to judge scriptural validity, loosly translated, "what has been believed everywhere, always, and by all."
Many have bought into the real heresy that we have complete freedom, under the guise of the Holy Spirit's dwellign in our heart, to translate scripture in any way that pleases us, this has only been believed in very, very recent times.
We need to have a real strong, in fact absolute belief in scriptural integrity. Then let God move us to apply those things He's shown us, and then trust God to move the Chruch into orthodox undererstandign of those things.
Kathy again, thanks for a great blog! |
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| You know, I've got to find what;s been causing all those letters to turn around when I type......where's spell czech win I knead it? |
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Kathy |
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October 19, 2007 at 4:17pm |
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Hal, I love and respect my many fundamentalist friends and am quite aware of the importance placed on the "i" words. I thank you for commenting here, as my blog is really incomplete without input from your viewpoint. I attended Southeastern Baptist Theological Seminary during the end of the Southern Baptist "war," so I am accustomed to being labelled by others, although then and now I refuse to pin any label on myself, other than "Child of God." Moderates have called me a fundamentalist, and conservatives have called me a liberal. I have no need to fit into any camp, preferring to look to God for my direction rather to any political faction. (I'm also a registered Independent!) As for my blog title leading readers to believe the Bible is a book of fables, I sincerely hope you are wrong about this. The title is meant to create enough interest to get them to read, and if they read, I don't know how that could come to that conclusion. (You have a legitimate point though. When I wrote my Women, Shut Up blog, I got a few comments attacking me for being so narrow-minded, and they obviously read nothing but the title.) Thank you for weighing in! I appreciate you, my friend!
Jack, I would agree with you that some of the discrepancies are important ones. I chose the word "small", however, because I made the claim there were hundreds, and the overwhelming majority of those of "small."
Thank you Deb and Jess! Jess, I blogged about that here: Why Biblical Guidance Doesn't Work
Golden, thank you! I didn't realize I only gave the book reference. I have now added the chapters, and you can find the Satan vs. Lord part in verse 1 of both chapters. Read a few verses into the chapter to reach the numbers. You seem to be searching the KJV which uses the word "provoked" rather than "incited" and does indeed call 1 million "one thousand thousands." And both passages seem to refer only to men, as they both specify the number as "valiant men who drew a sword." I appreciate your input. You bring up some good issues!
Dennis, Eye like the weigh ewe spell "undererstandign." Know spell czech kneaded! (And I like your points!)
Soldier, thank you for sharing your thoughts. |
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Jack,
I started out thinking about why you would ask the question, but then decided to understand why I even used that phrase. I tend to use words by inferential meaning instead of accurate understanding of their meanings (comes from reading everything in sight, yet having a poor memory). I will answer with a new blog, but it may takle a while to sort out my response and post the blog. It actually turns out to be a great question, I'm just not sure how to answer it in a reasonably short blog! |
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Soldier I apologize for the assuption that you had many profiles and were argumentative... sometimes my mouth gets in the way of my fingers. I have not read anything that you have posted. That was wrong of me.
Jack... I'm sorry I don't understand.. but you do have a way with words, sir!
Kathy...
"As for my blog title leading readers to believe the Bible is a book of fables, I sincerely hope you are wrong about this".
LOL Kathy - Hence the words: You are not saying this as far as I can tell!
But some folks don't take the time to read the fine print.... (sigh) as you well know...
Sorry about the labels, too, I proudly wear "conservative" in all senses of that word and "fundamentalist" in the narrow theological sense. I don't know where to put you yet... LOL
I'm just trying to put the fun in "fundamentalist!" |
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OK Kathy,
I'm moving my thoughts off to a separate blog. Thanks so very much for getting me started, I've been meaning to write some of these thoughts down for quite a while!
Scripture . |
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Kathy |
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October 19, 2007 at 7:33pm |
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Restore, oh, this one may not be peaceful bedtime reading! Rest well! Hal, lol, if you get it figured out, share it with me! :) Dennis, thanks for the plug. I look forward to reading your blog, but will wait until I'm less tired! You must have already thought that blog out. You posted it quickly!
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| No Kathy, I'm just rash and impulsive.....hehe |
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I LOVE YOU KATHY...
reading your blogs are like reading into your soul through your picture... you are so beautiful... you are so transparent.... you are sooooo Jesus like....
love
7 of 9 |
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Kathy-
being the "fundamentalist" that I am, I find myself more in line with Hal's responses to this blog. You definitely walk a TIGHT ROPE between the 2 prevailing views concerning the inerrancy of scripture and Its inspiration as well. My main concern is that this type of rhetoric leads down the "slippery slope" of the old addage "destroy the 'messenger'; destroy the message" that allows for heresy and false doctrine to arise and spread... since the actual integrity and authority of the SOURCE (ie; the Word of God) is attacked and questioned. You make many GOOD points and raise some thought-provoking ideas, especially with the accounts of David. Another NT example is the various recordings of Jairus' plea and interaction with Jesus and the ensuing miraculous resurrection of his daughter. Again, I'm not trying to "discredit" the SOURCE when playing "devil's advocate" along with the thesis of your blog...
Semper Fidelis!
Joel |
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| Liberal is not the word for it, try radical left, Southern Poverty Law Center anyone? |
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Kathy...
I love you and I love reading your blogs... it is like... a window into your soul... and i see you I hear you I feel you I smell you ... it is tangible...
and I love you YOU my CHILD are so beautiful and I know JESUS smiles and laughs when he sees the LOVE IN YOU... I KNOW YOU make Jesus rejoice....
YOU... KATHY... are a Saint...
I truly love you
7 of 9 |
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BlewJ |
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October 19, 2007 at 9:04pm |
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| I'm glad to see there are some Christians out there who don't think of the Bible in the same way the Muslims believe in the Qu'ran. I agree with most of your sentiments; I love how God chooses fallible, sinful, finite human beings to work within and through. Quite amazing, really, how the divine and the earthly mingle by His grace. |
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Kathy, on the continuum that goes from totally discounting the Bible as a book of fiction to revering the book as literal absolute truth, you fall closer to the latter end than the former, i.e. I believe you are more conservative than the title of this blog would seem to suggest. You made good points in your blog and of course you wrote it very well!
One small dissension. Towards the end you said that "Paul, for example, did not refer to his writings as Scripture". The apostle Peter did, however, refer to all of Paul's letters as Scripture (2 Pet 3:6). Apparently Peter and the early church elevated Paul's letters to the same category as the writings of the OT. Also, Paul considered Luke's gospel to be "Scripture". In 1 Timothy 5:18 he quoted Luke 10:7, stating that "the Scripture says". I find it likely that other NT writings were regarded with the authority of Scripture by the early church as well.
Besides the Bible, no other book claims to be "God-breathed". No other book is the legitimate source of the words "thus says the Lord" (which appear repeatedly, in fact) and the commands of the Lord (for example, OT: Deuteronomy 5:1; NT: 1 Corinthians 14:37). No other book has the power to change people's lives (and the world!) like the Bible does. The Spirit's main channel of revealing truths about God to mankind is through the Bible. God may not have literally written the books of the Bible, but there was most definitely a strong supernatural element (Holy Spirit) deeply involved in their authorship. Discrepancies? A few, yes, all minor. Definitely not as many as some people claim, and definitely not as serious as some claim either!
I find every one of your blogs an interesting read, this one no exception! Thanks for making me think today, Kathy! And I'll echo your closing line, "Thanks be to God for the great and wonderful gift of His Word!" ~mike |
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Valya |
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October 19, 2007 at 9:46pm |
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| THANK YOU FOR THIS BLOG! I have had some discussions about this with my friend a while ago. I support you so much on that we can't read the Bible in the context of 2007 America. The cultures of their time and ours are so different that we cannot just put those ideas in a literal translation of how we understand those phrases today. Honestly telling you, I had some problems with English interpretation of the Bible after being brought up on the Russian version of it - and both were translated from the same Book! Many things in English do not have the same meaning that they do in Russian today. How about adding more cultural differences over some thousands of years! It is a hard concept to grasp if one doesn't go through experiencing "other ways" of "other peoples"; experiencing some good deal of culture shock may actually make us all more understanding of each other and open our eyes on that some people can actually look at our axioms with wonder. |
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Kathy |
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October 19, 2007 at 10:11pm |
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Seven, thank you for your kindness, although your praise for me is far too lofty! Are all StarTrek characters so affirming?! (Confession: I have never watched StarTrek.)
Wyatt, thanks for reading this blog and sharing your reaction. I know this blog will not win any fundamentalist awards, and I respect that opinion. To all who are in that camp, I respectfully question the "slippery slope" imagery. Should one slide down that slope, where would she land? Isolated from salvation or merely outside the fundamentalists' good graces? If you answer the former, do you honestly perceive me as one who is "one breath away" from being "unsaved"? I do not share that fear, despite the acknowledgement that I am sure I don't have everything all figured out perfectly.
Recon, always a pleasure to see you again.
BlewJ, Thank you for sharing your reaction!
Grant posted a great blog that relates to this blog topic: How to Read the Bible without Becoming a Wacko |
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Kathy |
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October 19, 2007 at 10:35pm |
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Mike, you raise some points worth examining. It is true that, although the canon was not officially set until the 4th century, by the 2nd century, many of the NT writings (and some apocraphal ones) were being circulated around the churches as Scripture. I am not familiar with this happening during the first century to show up in the NT writings. Your first reference, 2 Pet. 3:6 seems to be the wrong verse. I hope you will check it and come back and let me know. The 1 Timothy passage is quoting Deuteronomy, not Luke, although Luke also quoted the same passage. Deut. 24:15 deals with the day's wages, and Deut. 25:4 with the oxen. I agree with you on the importance of the Scripture and on its power to change lives, and you are right that it is important to me! :) Thanks, my friend!
Valya, there is a wisdom that comes from knowing other languages and cultures that can never come through books. Your life experiences are a gift. I pray for you that you will never just accept anything I or anyone else says, without studying it and prayerfully pondering it for yourself. Much of what I write is what I am still working through for myself. I would love to hear about some of the translation differences between the Russian and English Bibles. This is always the case with translation. Sometimes when I read the Spanish Bible, I don't recognize a very familiar passage. I'm glad you're my friend! |
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Typo! Sorry, 2 Peter 3:16. :-)
Regarding the Luke/Deut passage, my cross references (NIV) did not show the Deut passage. I presume the reason is b/c the 1 Timothy passage actually quotes Luke 10:7 word for word, whereas the Deut 24:15 is where the underlying principle appears in God's law. I checked cross references in the NASB and ESV, and both of these included the Deut reference as well. |
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Yes Jack, pleeeaaaase set me straight! 
Wurmbrand's quote is great. He says the Bible is the truth about the Truth. That's truth one generation removed from the Truth. So everything else is truth 2 generations removed from the original. Therefore, you can do no better than to go straight to the Bible if you want to know about the Truth!
And that is precisely where I send people. Thanks Jack! |
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Kathy,
Once again a great post...lots of good discussions too. I would like to see you expand on your thoughts on the paragraph you started with "Today’s Christian culture has become extremely political and polarized within itself. " Think about it please. There is a lot of truth buried in that paragaph that needs kneading, IMHO.
Your post brings to mind a visit I had to one of my Baptist family members. My family consists of many Baptists, some of which are preachers. I was sitting in this person's dining room doing my daily devotion. I always write notes in my Bible to include the dates I read it, what it meant to me that time through, and anything else that seems important. This person was appalled that I would write in the Bible. Wasn't that adding to God's word? Culture, even within our culture, can sometimes have different meanings. To her, the Bible was indeed holy and anything, like I was doing, was defacing it. I would also venture to say that she never wrote on a dollar bill either because that would be defacing government property. Perhaps she would think of the Bible as holy and the dollar bill as carnal, but the culture breeds the same reaction - a sincere respect for the authority of the printed paper.
I only share this example to add to your post that we all see through a glass dimly. We all need each other's understanding as living stones in this body of Christ. As clay vessels broken by sin we are fallible and in need of a Savior. As such, each and every one of us makes mistakes, uses the wrong words at times, and, misplace, punctuation, every, now, and, then (most of the early text had no punctuation). Given this, it is hard to accept the fact that somewhere, in one of the many translations, that somebody didn't miss a punctuation mark, read too much into a given word, or just didn't know how to translate it because the words are few and different. This only makes me want to know more, understand better, and be more in awe of our God who chooses to use us knowing exactly how far short of His glory we fall.
As for labels...well, the only one I will place on you is "sister". Let's walk through history together and see where He takes us. |
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Voice,
I just love your thinking, and your heart.
Pastor Aminata |
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Grant |
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October 20, 2007 at 5:08am |
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| Ah, finally found this famous post. Seems like great minds think alike. As a fundaliberal, or is that evangamentalist, or is that legalistically non-legalistic? Oh, well, I'm glad to read your well-formulated words. I've always wondered why God just did not inspire the word "inerrant" as a part of Holy Scripture. Perhaps God was "errant" for not having done so... LOL ...not! :) |
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Kathy-
you said "Isolated from salvation or merely outside the fundamentalists' good graces? If you answer the former, do you honestly perceive me as one who is "one breath away" from being "unsaved"?
I'm not advocating that at all. What I mean is that this implication gives way to questioning the accuracy and authenticity and even credebility of the Bible... then cheapens It to just another "religious book" of a lineage of Divine revelation, which leads to much of the heresy we hear today. I don't question your salvation, nor do I feel that you can lose something you couldn't earn and was FREELY given to you by God Himself thru your faith in His Son. |
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| Wow! So much that I have been thinking about, too... |
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Kathy |
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October 20, 2007 at 5:16pm |
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